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Old 09-19-2005   #1
stuntdubl
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Lightbulb Increase Your Link Request Conversion - Don't Do This!

Composing an unsolicited link request is becoming more and more of a risky proposition. With hosts shutting off accounts, G banning sites, and all the other potential pitfalls, you really have to be careful doing link requests these days.

Don't use the shotgun approach of 1k mails to everyone who ranks for the phrase you want with a generic form letter. Personalize your link requests, and don't do them unless there is potential value to the website owner.

Put yourself on the recipient end...what would it take for YOU to give a link. Offer that in return. Link development is a manual process. That's why no one wants to do it, and you can beat your competitors if you see the value and do.

As a link request recipient, you can guarantee you'll be hitting my recycle bin if You:
  • Don't use an e-mail from the site you are requesting a link for
  • Write an e-mail that sounds like it could have been sent to 500 people
  • Don't give your phone number
  • Don't give your full name
  • Obviously scraped a search result I know I rank for
  • Mention PageRank
  • Have to TELL me that your link directory is a resource
  • Try to give me a reciprocal link on a links page
  • Request a link on a page there are no other links outside of the site
  • Canta speaka very good English or spel corectly
  • Don't understand the value of a link
  • Can't write more than a sentence long request
  • Sent the e-mail to a "catchall" e-mail address
  • Can't address me by my first name
  • Call me "Dear Webmaster"
  • Name any of your pages "links.html"
  • Try to get 3 links from me the first time you talk to me
  • Are not even CLOSELY related to my site
  • Have nothing to offer in return
  • Only TAKE from the wonderful world wide web

I don't want your crappy links! Neither does anybody else. Don't make these fuds, and you'll have a much higher likelihood of getting positive responses to your link requests. Focus on naturally attracting links with content, and then just occassionally tip people off to it. It's a lot easier in the long run to make friends that help with long term gain than it is to make enemies from your short term gains. Kinda like the price of retaining a customer vs. keeping a customer. Practing good business link development is just good economics. Don't stoop to the short term tactics that some of your competitors may be getting by with. Build link development strategies for future success, not just for short term solutions to ineffective search algorithms. Crappy reciprocal links pages will never survive. Evolve or Die. Just don't whine to me when your site becomes collateral damage.

"Links are much like currency on the web: If you don't have a value proposition then don't bother asking for a link." - Mike Grehan

What other types of things tend to increase/decrease link request conversion?
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Old 09-19-2005   #2
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Or not even requesting links at all, Just send emails saying things like "golly your site is great" we really like it over here on "mysite.com" my users have told me all about it. Then insert fluff about their site and that's it for your email.

Then have their web site linked on your site somewhere. When the mark come's and look's at your site he/she see's the link and is motivated to reciprocate.

If you don't see a link anywhere in a week or two then you delete your link to them.

Email is getting dangerous for link building now a days. I don't know if I would risk a direct request anymore.
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Old 09-19-2005   #3
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heh, I am laughing

Recips work well. People have been saying that they are going to be devalued for years. Why would I look for links manually when I can get 100k of mails or contact forms, fire them off in a mailer, submitter and go down the pub. On the return there is a nice full inbox full of people who want to exchange links with my monkeys. Do not knock it my friend, we got it down to a fine art and can get 1000+ recips a day. People want to swap links.

Last edited by maxd : 09-19-2005 at 03:44 PM.
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Old 09-19-2005   #4
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I've found personally that the people who want to recip with others regardless of the quality or relevance of the link tend to be uneducated and/or desperate.

Since it takes roughly 4100 PR 2 links to equal one PR 6 link, you are going to need to be building those thousands of links every day. Hope you have room for all of them.

Personally, I just make a great site, then phone up some known excellent on-topic site webmasters, and follow through with some carefully chosen long term secondary strategies and find that I spend less time for better results.

The only downside is that you actually need a good site to start with.

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Old 09-20-2005   #5
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Ian, I am neither uneducated and/or desperate and also I do not know how you quantify

"Since it takes roughly 4100 PR 2 links to equal one PR 6 link"

Please make a great content site for London hotels, phone up some webmasters and get on page 1 of google with a few links. I doubt it. Look at every site there, has minimum 3500 backlinks. It is about anchor still, not pagerank. Although I think trustrank will come more into play, already is, so for new sites it is now important to get some links from some authorities.

I know we take a different approach to some but we do very well in the serps and have crappy links pages.It is all on auto and not frustrating for my staff as the emails are permanently in the inbox for them. I used to pay people to surf manually and they got a few links per day ( and they were recips). This way is much much better and what makes your site better than anyone elses anyway? Everybody thinks that their site is superior in some way, even some mum and pop site.
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Old 09-20-2005   #6
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First of all not 4100 PR2 but 16,803. I dont really believe that someone finding link partners one by one, searching for the contact name and email and all this manually? Second question: had anyboby contacted PR5,6,7 website to link to your PR2? So if u have new website which has low PR nobody will link u. How will u improve PR? I asume ull ask websites with more or less similar PR and ull do it quick using automated soft. Dont tell me u wont.
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Old 09-20-2005   #7
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I am starting to believe in networks of friends is the safest route to get links to your new sites via request.

Of course I wouldn't link to a crap site if it was my friends but if they had a semi decent site and it was relevent I would.

the real question is... how to create those social networks.
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Old 09-20-2005   #8
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Quote:
...the real question is... how to create those social networks.
in this case it is easier to start from niche directories that already have some quality inclusion guidelines. Then just go down the list and see if their members' sites are answering your quality guidelines. I know that's called manual requests, but its pretty clean, relevant and targeted.
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Old 09-21-2005   #9
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Not forgetting the 10 days to reciprocate or they'll delete your link from their wonderful directory....
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Old 09-21-2005   #10
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Personally, I've only ever exchanged links less than a handful of times, and never with a "links" page, or from an email request. But I understand maxd. Most websites want to exchange links because most website owners are uneducated in the ways of search engines. They probably know that links are good for rankings, but that's about all.

The comparitively few people who know more than that would be wary of links pages and very low PR exchanges, and of the possibility that the engines may devalue links pages, but most website owners wouldn't know enough to think about things like that.

stuntdubl's post is from the point of view of someone with knowledge of these things, and I doubt that anyone who comes to this forum and reads this thread will do any different to him - delete the emails - but most website owners will never visit a forum like this, and most of them do know enough to want to exchange links.
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Old 09-22-2005   #11
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I try to personalize as much as possible, and I have never sent bulk mail asking for links. Sometimes I cannot address the recipient by name or use a personal e-mail address because I can't find them.

But, yes, I would never do anything so crass as mentioning PR, and I'm always offended when someone send me an e-mail with that as a reason to link. I only ask for links from sites which I think my site would complement and whose users I think would benefit from my site.
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Old 09-23-2005   #12
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"Most websites want to exchange links because most website owners are uneducated in the ways of search engines"

Phil I disagree there. All the webmasters in big city hotels know what they are doing and are not green at all, make 1000's per month and most of them have links pages. The really smart ones have directories and do 3 ways. It is almost as though links pages are tolerated in the travel industry.

A few plus points links pages have. Get the right category you get the right page title and other relevant "resources" on page. Different c class IP's compared to buying ROS links on one IP. Linking to people in the same industy for theming etc.

The only thing I do not like if you get a manual check they will push the no serps button for breaking the SE's guidelines.
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Old 09-23-2005   #13
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*It is almost as though links pages are tolerated in the travel industry.*

You're right there Max, some of the stuff they get away with is simply jaw-dropping.
I've seen people try the same tricks in more "genteel" sectors, retribution has usually been fairly swift...
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Old 09-27-2005   #14
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newbie

Forgive me for asking the stupid question here, but here goes. How do you go about getting links? Obviously I agree with a lot of what was said by stuntdubl. I haven't actually tried to get any links yet but will have to very soon. I must admit that my first inclination was to have a links page (Travel Industry ) and to send emails.

"naturally attracting links with content" - Surely you don't mean that if you have good content, you can just sit back and watch as people link to you??

"Obviously scraped a search result I know I rank for" - How would you know I done this? Unless of course, I told you

"Try to give me a reciprocal link on a links page" - just trying to learn something here, in case anyone thinks I'm being critical. Supposing I am "acquiring" links, I don't understand why someone would link to my site without me linking to there site (referring to relevant sites). So if I am correct then in order for my site to get a lot of IBL's, I will need to have a lot of links on my site, to other sites. How is this achieved without a links page? Surely you would affect the design of the site if you had links all over it to other sites?

thanks

KP
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Old 09-27-2005   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KPickenJr
Forgive me for asking the stupid question here, but here goes. How do you go about getting links? ...KP
Hi KP and welcome to the SEW forum. Please see this thread to further educate you about getting links...read the whole thing and all the links, and you should be well on your way (to the next day )
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