Search Engine Watch
SEO News

Go Back   Search Engine Watch Forums > Search Engine Marketing Strategies > Search Engine Marketing > Outsourcing SEM
FAQ Members List Calendar Forum Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-30-2004   #1
Freedom1029
 
Posts: n/a
Did Traffic Power Get Me Kicked Out of Google!?

Hi there,
We are using an outside firm to improve our ranking and up to last week we were very happy with the results however since last weekend our domain name is not longer indexed with google.

I contacted the company doing our optimisation (Traffic Power) and they told me that they were aware of the problem and that they had the same problem with many clients. According to them they were not doing anything wrong and are following all of Goggle’s rules. They told me to sit tight and wait and that everything should come back to normal in a few days. Is that a bunch of rubbish of what! Anyway so my questions are: Did google change any of their rules lately? How can I find why we got kick out? Is there anything I can do to correct the situation?
Thanks for your help
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #2
Webmaster T
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 64
Webmaster T is a jewel in the roughWebmaster T is a jewel in the roughWebmaster T is a jewel in the rough
Search Google for Traffic-Power! I would be very skeptical of anything they tell you. Also to verify that you are indeed banned search using:
site:www.yourdomain.com

That search will list any pages in the Google index from your domain.
Webmaster T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #3
Freedom1029
 
Posts: n/a
Hum just tried to search with the engine www.yourdomain.com and nothing is coming out! Oh boy my boss is going to kill me!
Our domain is www.clemex.com.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #4
Phoenix
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 97
Phoenix is just really nicePhoenix is just really nicePhoenix is just really nicePhoenix is just really nicePhoenix is just really nice
Recovering from Traffic Power penalization

Hi Freedom,

I have just gone through the process with a client this past week on getting unpenalized from the Traffic Power issues. One of the causes of this penalization from Google has to do with all the doorway pages that traffic power has developed for your website. I am quessing they probably used duplicate content from your site as well as the same graphics to create these site. Additionally with multiple hidden subpages on the subject, all with urls that contain an email letter like so "youkeyphrases_f.html".

Now how to clean this up is relatively not to difficult, but it will take communicate with traffic power. You must remove all instance of the spam they created for your site. Do not listen to Traffic Power when they say "not doing anything wrong and are following all of Goggle’s rules". They how come hundreds of their clients got penalized in Google??? Avoid bad advice when possible.

Quote:
They told me to sit tight and wait and that everything should come back to normal in a few days.
Crazy incorrect bad strategy statement. Google penalities can last up to 2 years! Do you think they are going to fix this in a matter of a few days. No!
You should be doing what you can now.

Quote:
Did google change any of their rules lately?
Yes they did, please take a look at this article here:
http://www.seroundtable.com/archives/000596.html

Basically Google is now penalizing or removing site that have OnMouseOver JavaScript Page Redirects. And I am thinking for some of traffic power clients, there might be a duplicate content penalty going on. T-P was pretty lazy about a lot of this stuff.

What to do:

1. Ask Traffic Power to close you account, and eliminate any mention of your name or links on the doorway pages they created (on ALL of them). MAKE SURE to tell TP, you want to TAKE DOWN and REMOVE the entire site. Meaning you can't access it, it has no content, etc...

2. Get confirmation that is all done. Keep copies of Traffic Power emails. Check over your site to make sure it conforms with googles quality standards. If it does its ready to be resubmited.

3. Send email to: webmaster@google.com or help@google.com with the Subject: "Reinclusion Request".
Tell Google you were a customer of Traffic Power. Were not aware their techniques violated Googles quality quidelines, standards, and TOS. All problem pages have been cleaned up. You would like to resubmit your site for reinclusion.

Included copies of Traffic Power emails confirming content has been taken down with the email if needed.

4. Google will email you back. They will say thank you, and that the matter will be forwarded to Google engineers who will look over your site within 4-6 weeks.

5. Wait for Google to get back with you. Time period can vary widely, but I doubt they will be in any hurry.


Hope that should help. This is what I did for a site that had got penalized for the exact thing. The interesting thing was the client of mine, cancelled it traffic power account over 8 months ago, but the doorway pages still remained. I feel bad for the client of mine, cause they did really great in the serps before this update.



Ben P.

Last edited by Phoenix : 06-30-2004 at 03:53 PM.
Phoenix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #5
Webmaster T
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 64
Webmaster T is a jewel in the roughWebmaster T is a jewel in the roughWebmaster T is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom1029
Hum just tried to search with the engine www.yourdomain.com and nothing is coming out! Oh boy my boss is going to kill me!
Our domain is www.clemex.com.
IMO, no he shouldn't you are 1 of likely a thousand. Google allowed this company's work to stay in the SERPs months after the reports started coming into forums and I'm sure their own spam reports.

IMO, Googles choice of dealing with this stuff algorithmically is directly responsible for this scam reaching the proportions it has. We aren't talking about an isolated low number of occurences of this stuff there are IMO, possibly 1,000+ sites affected that's why the buzz is now loud where it was simply a hum a few months back. The only negative thing I can say about those affected was proper due diligence was not done. T-P has been out of the Google index for quite some time. I can show you posts on another forum that are over a year old warning people about this particular firm!

This article by Chris Sherman should be read by anyone looking for an SEO. You'll also find good info on the sites listed in it. Not listed is www.SEMPO.org which also is good place to find info and SEO listings.
http://searchenginewatch.com/searchd...le.php/2160051

Hope this helps and keeps you out of your bosses dog house!
Webmaster T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #6
NFFC
"One wants to have, you know, a little class." DianeV
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 468
NFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to behold
>Not listed is www.SEMPO.org which also is good place to find info and SEO listings

You forgot to say IMHO.
NFFC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #7
David Wallace
 
David Wallace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 887
David Wallace is a splendid one to beholdDavid Wallace is a splendid one to beholdDavid Wallace is a splendid one to beholdDavid Wallace is a splendid one to beholdDavid Wallace is a splendid one to beholdDavid Wallace is a splendid one to beholdDavid Wallace is a splendid one to behold
We have a pretty good thread going on this at High Rankings.

There is also this one going on over at Jim World.

The first one is new; the one at JW has been going on for about a year and a half now.
David Wallace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #8
Bernard
www.measuring-up.com
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Friendswood, TX
Posts: 92
Bernard is an unknown quantity at this point
Traffic Power - class action lawsuit, 12 step program, fora threads index, company background and more.

T, I'm shocked that you are recommending folks use SEMPO as a means to find an SEO company. SEMPO does not screen the membership in any way whatsoever. As long as they pay, they are in. Traffic Power could have been (maybe they are, I haven't checked) a member if they wanted.

Last edited by Bernard : 07-02-2004 at 04:38 PM.
Bernard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #9
Nacho
 
Nacho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: La Jolla, CA
Posts: 1,382
Nacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to behold
Traffic-Power is NOT a member of SEMPO.org, you can check member listings here and select letter "T".

Lets not discuss SEMPO's mission in this thread please, to stay on topic - thanks!
Nacho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2004   #10
seobook
I'm blogging this
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: we are Penn State!
Posts: 1,943
seobook is a name known to allseobook is a name known to allseobook is a name known to allseobook is a name known to allseobook is a name known to allseobook is a name known to all
Traffic Power called me up not that long ago. Lots of negative feedback from others on my review of Traffic Power .

they are consistantly one of my top half dozen (often times tip 3) keyword referals. that must be a bunch of cold calling...
__________________
The SEO Book
seobook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2004   #11
dannysullivan
Editor, SearchEngineLand.com (Info, Great Columns & Daily Recap Of Search News!)
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Search Engine Land
Posts: 2,085
dannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud ofdannysullivan has much to be proud of
Not trying to get off the topic of Traffic Power, but this comment raises an important general point:

Quote:
T, shame on you recommending folks use SEMPO as a means to find an SEO company. SEMPO does not screen the membership in any way whatsoever. As long as they pay, they are in. Traffic Power could have been (maybe they are, I haven't checked) a member if they wanted.
There's nothing wrong in my book in suggesting people look at SEMPO. It's one of many resources out there. It would be wrong to suggest that SEMPO is somehow screening members or providing some type of quality guarantee. They don't do that, and I don't think anyone has posted that in this thread. SEMPOs also got a number of big notes in key parts of its site making it clear they don't do this:
SEMPO is an industry organization designed to promote search engine marketing in general, not an accreditation body for SEM companies. Membership in SEMPO is not a guarantee of a particular search engine marketing company's capabilities, nor does it signify industry approval or disapproval of their practices. Potential SEM customers should carefully research any SEM company they are considering, SEMPO member or not, before establishing a business relationship.
I use my yellow pages all the time. Anyone who pays get into that. Heck, if I search for search engine optimization companies at Google, I get a bunch of ads for companies that aren't screened. Anyone who pays gets in there.

So are these useless resources? Not at all. As a consumer, it's my responsibility to check on references and understand who I choose to do business with. The rules are the same with SEM. There are plenty of resources to find companies that exist to help you. Ultimately, it remains up to you to check them out.

By the way, I think what the SEO Consultants Directory and SeoPros.org do to try and some how give you a list of approved firms is great. But there may be perfectly good firms that simply don't list themselves in these places.

To bring it all back to the original point of this thread, is Traffic Power in trouble with Google? Hopefully, they'll give you an answer. But it would be much better if Google and the other search engines simply published lists of firms that they have banned. Then you'd know for certain easily. They don't, of course. I talked about this problem more in this recent article, which also revisits the whole topic of knowing who to trust: Spam Rules Require Effective Spam Police.

Last edited by dannysullivan : 07-01-2004 at 11:20 AM.
dannysullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2004   #12
Bernard
www.measuring-up.com
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Friendswood, TX
Posts: 92
Bernard is an unknown quantity at this point
I perceive a huge irony in a suggestion that folks look for SEO companies in an unqualified list within a thread describing the problems with a company that by all accounts has managed to get their clients banned from Google.

I think that if a class action lawsuit against Traffic Power materializes, the point of whether or not Traffic Power is in trouble with Google will be demonstrated in court. For now, the empirical evidence is mounting and only the blind cannot see what has happened.

My hope is that if the class action lawsuit does materialize and succeed, it may drive some positive changes within the industry. Hopefully the neverending "debates" about ethics will become moot.
Bernard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2004   #13
Webmaster T
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 64
Webmaster T is a jewel in the roughWebmaster T is a jewel in the roughWebmaster T is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannysullivan
So are these useless resources? Not at all. As a consumer, it's my responsibility to check on references and understand who I choose to do business with. The rules are the same with SEM. There are plenty of resources to find companies that exist to help you. Ultimately, it remains up to you to check them out.
Excellent advice. Traffic Power was in the SeoPros directory for a brief period of time. They slipped under the radar and AFAIK at that time weren't doing what they are now. It's been 18 months or more since they were removed from the directory. Another SEO that has warranted a protest site and is mentioned on more than 1 forum was for a brief period in both SeoConsultants and SeoPros so reviews are not a guarantee of anything. Consumers should do due diligence which includes searching forums and SE for info on any company they are considering. Asking for references is good as well but keep in mind they likely are going to provide clients who they know will provide a good reference. I'd suggest contacting clients found in the third search below.

In Google search using:
1. site:wwww.companyurl.com :are they banned? Quite likely if there are no results
2. site:wwww.companyurl.com -site:wwww.companyurl.com : Do they use legit and long term link development techniques
3. link:wwww.companyurl.com : will often include clients, repeat the search above for indications of how they perform their link services
4. search on company phone number and address : reveals mini-site and mirror sites. Note sometimes aliased domains are found so finding them under another one doesn't necessarily mean a mirror or mini-site check some of the well known directories to see if they are promoting more than 1 domain in the same business
5. If they have a client list skip 2,3 and 4 and do 1,2,3 and 4 using the clients info

AFAIK, The same syntax used in the searches above also works on Yahoo! so if you want to go a step further do the same searches there. I would also suggest searching forums for the company keeping in mind that what is there may be written by a competitor or company personelle masquerading as an anonymous poster.

Last edited by Webmaster T : 07-01-2004 at 02:38 PM.
Webmaster T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2004   #14
donut
"No, no!" said the Queen. "Sentence first - verdict afterwards."
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 48
donut is on a distinguished road
The problem with referrals is that Traffic Power's clients were very happy with their high rankings- most people probably were happy to recommend them because their hidden links and other tricks were working... for a while.

But it's good to know that others in the industry "outed" their techniques many moons ago. I think most clients who bothered to do their research and knew there was something spammy going on just thought they were getting a better deal than everyone else.

They did. For a while.

Last edited by donut : 07-01-2004 at 10:29 PM. Reason: spelling
donut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2004   #15
projectphp
What The World, Needs Now, Is Love, Sweet Love
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 449
projectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
By the way, I think what the SEO Consultants Directory and SeoPros.org do to try and some how give you a list of approved firms is great.
An area in which both SEOConsultants and SEOPros could improve is in listing the date of last review for each company e.g. on the pages http://seopros.org/seo/profile.asp?consultant=4E71C andhttp://www.seoconsultants.com/profile/1029/, which don't contain a review date.

To be fair, SEOPros do list this on the country pages (http://seopros.org/seo/New-Zealand.asp), but a date on each specific page is a good idea.

IMHO, that little change would make a huge difference.

Quote:
The problem with referrals is that Traffic Power's clients were very happy with their high rankings- most people probably were happy to recommend them because their hidden links and other tricks were working... for a while.
Which makes SEO so hard to dignify. Happy customers are not always a great way to gauge an SEO's value, because as was pointed out, by the time the clients are unhappy, the whole world knows!
projectphp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2004   #16
Jeff Nienaber
AgencyO
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27
Jeff Nienaber is on a distinguished road
Coincidently T-P contacted me just yesterday, and let me say, these kids are far from done. Whatever fix Google implemented was merely a band-aid.
Case in point:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...ntrol+golf+bag

Here's their current published client list. Anyone know any of these victims?
http://traffic-power.com/aCe/
Jeff Nienaber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2004   #17
NFFC
"One wants to have, you know, a little class." DianeV
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 468
NFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to behold
>these kids are far from done

Yeah, really they should have been burnt at a stake. It seems they have embarked on a twisted and devious plan to get web sites to rank well in the serps for terms that are very relevent to the site.

Thats unforgivable in my book, if a searcher types in "remote control golf bag" at google they get deceptively take to a page that....oh wait....my oh my...its a page about remote control golf bags.

So let me get this straight, a searcher types a term and gets taken to a relevent page. Am I missing something here?
NFFC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2004   #18
Jeff Nienaber
AgencyO
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27
Jeff Nienaber is on a distinguished road
NFFC >"Am I missing something here?"

Yeah, you missed what most users miss. The OnMouseOver JavaScript Redirect

If you click the first link in the above SERP www.kaddyusa.com/remote_control_golf_bag_l.html and make sure not to move your mouse, you'll see the black hat in action.
Jeff Nienaber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2004   #19
NFFC
"One wants to have, you know, a little class." DianeV
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 468
NFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to beholdNFFC is a splendid one to behold
>Yeah, you missed what most users miss. The OnMouseOver JavaScript Redirect

I was being sarcastic.

Once again, a searcher types a term and gets taken to a relevent page. Show me who the victim is?
NFFC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2004   #20
Nacho
 
Nacho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: La Jolla, CA
Posts: 1,382
Nacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to beholdNacho is a splendid one to behold
Just in case someone blinked while it happened, this is what it looked like :

Nacho is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off