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Old 02-08-2005   #1
meechp123
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Is DMOZ really that great?

This has happened to me on several occasions; I use a simple search query such as "rhode island mortgage" and I get this error:

The Open Directory search is currently under a heavy load. Please try back later. No Open Directory Project results found

This has happened several times. I go back to check on a site submission, thinking that I can use those terms, and it crashes. Is this site really all that important? Yes, I know that Google pulls from DMOZ, but come on.......
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Old 02-08-2005   #2
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>>Is it really that important?

nope. Put it on the been there done that list and move on.
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Old 02-08-2005   #3
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What about the people in charge of DMOZ? After reading their forum, I feel as though some are a bunch of elitist individuals....and I'm not saying this because they denied my submission (I submitted a month ago, lord knows it takes them like 5 years to submit a link), I just feel this way; anyone else feel the same?
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Old 02-08-2005   #4
Gerardism
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Still of some importance

I still feel that DMOZ has some importance and is a good place to get listed if you can. But if you don't get listed, there are still other good directories to be listed. So at least you're not stuck.

I am an Open Directory editor for a few smaller categories, and for my own personal site to get listed, it took about 5 and 1/2 months. Being an editor, I have the option to check other editors logs to see how active they are and get an idea if/when a site can get added (and to guess a possible timeframe).

Generally I don't find it too bad, from my own personal experience, it helps on the submitters end to follow the guidelines as closely as possible, and try to get a feel for what the current editor is allowing in.
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Old 02-09-2005   #5
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Arrow

DMOZ takes a few minutes to submit to. If your site meets the criteria for a listing, you get:

1) A link with PR (may be high if in a higher level category)
2) A link that does not have to be reciprocated.
3) A link from an 'authority' site
4) A link that is copied by the 4000 or so clones of DMOZ, of which a surprising number have PR and are listed in Google (even if they have low PR - if your site name is your keywords --> 1000's of anchor text links)
5) A little traffic, if you are lucky
6) A link that Google *may* give higher value to (some argue this, but I don't think it does).

For the few minutes it takes to submit, how important do you think the above is?
What other link or directory can give you all that?

Last edited by cbp : 02-09-2005 at 02:37 AM.
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Old 02-09-2005   #6
jimnoble
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For the few minutes it takes to submit
I suggest you make that a quarter of an hour. That should give you enough time to find the correct category and craft a reasonably ODP guidelines compliant title and description that isn't a hyped keyword heaven. That'll make it stand out amongst the usual dreck that we see in competitive categories and maximise it's chances of being listed quickly.

If you also provide local services (and say so on the website, preferably with the address of a walk in store), don't forget to additionally suggest it to your locality. Locality means locality, not county/state/country.

--
Jim Noble
Volunteer ODP meta editor

Last edited by dannysullivan : 02-10-2005 at 07:12 AM. Reason: no live links in signatures per forum FAQ, please
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Old 02-09-2005   #7
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For a free effort - I think dmoz is amazing. You have to remember that every link is checked over by a human editor, so its going to take a long time.

I've been waiting a couple months for my site review. Although it takes forever to get reviewed, the editors over at resource-zone usually respond within the day about your questions.
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Old 02-09-2005   #8
St0n3y
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DMOZ still carries substantial weight, though for the life of me I can't understand why.
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Old 02-09-2005   #9
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I just hope they approve my site; I feel as though it's relevant (mortgage company in Rhode Island, only 13 other sites are listed in this category), but what if the editor doesn't? I just don't like that feeling of knowing that someone is judging my content...it just seems completely subjective.
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Old 02-10-2005   #10
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Don't expect it not to be subjective whenever there is a human being behind to decide whether to include your site or not. That's why many submitters have always believed that their site are being penalized when you see the level of paranoia in resource-zone concerning rejected sites.
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Old 02-10-2005   #11
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>I feel as though it's relevant

Thats the wrong question. Ask yourself, would your site add value to the category? Does it offer something that the sites currenty in the category do not offer?

The aim of DMOZ is to build categories of unique valuable websites and not list a whole lot of sites in category that have the same or similar content or sell the same product.

BTW - you started this thread and posted again in the thread to bash and criticize DMOZ .... and you hope for a listing in a Directory that you think is not all that great - why, then do you want to be listed in it for?

Last edited by cbp : 02-10-2005 at 03:52 AM.
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Old 02-10-2005   #12
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>BTW - you started this thread and posted again in the thread to bash and criticize DMOZ .... and you hope for a listing in a Directory that you think is not all that great - why, then do you want to be listed in it for?

Because we all know that it's important to get listed in DMOZ. Sure, I disagree with some of their practices, but, I'm not stupid. I just don't understand why DMOZ? Meaning, why not JoeAnt or another directory? DMOZ doesn't seem to be able to handle heavy loads, as this error constantly occurs:

The Open Directory search is currently under a heavy load. Please try back later. No Open Directory Project results found

What if Google returned results like that? How would people react?
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Old 02-10-2005   #13
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At the risk of offending any DMOZ editors here, I agree with meechp123. We all know that DMOZ is important but I personally believe they are given far more importance than they deserve.

Google's theory is that since this diretory does not charge for listings that somehow its more relevant or unbiased or whatever. C'mon, get real. Google is in search for money so why pretent that a directory that is not in the game for money is so much more noble?

I think there are many directories that are managed far better than DMOZ. Maybe its because those directories are smaller, or maybe because they charge, but DMOZ is certainly not free of its bias, nor is it professional (or of higher quality) to have unpaid editors that don't bother to review sites in a timely manner, leaving submissions to languish for months on end.

I understand that many DMOZ editors do their job quickly, efficiently and do it well, but I can't remember the last time I made a submission that was approved in less than six months.
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Old 02-10-2005   #14
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I think if they want to remain a premier directory, they need to overhaul the quality of sites, improve communicaiton with submitters, improve the search, and start to think about how they are perceived within this industry. I see so much hate posts about DMOZ. More than any other property. This perception needs to be addressed seriously and changed by DMOZ itself. One thing they need to change is to discuss with editors how they reply to posts in public forums like this one. I always see the following - Disgruntled submitter who didn't get listed, then an extremely "dig in the heels" defensive response from an editor. Both are wrong. I know the editors are volunteering their time, but if a volunteer for a politcal campaign acted inappropriately and it reflected on a candidate, they would be booted.
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Old 02-10-2005   #15
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Wink

My mother's people came by ship
And fought at Bunker Hill
My daddy lost a leg in France
I have his medal still
My brother served with Patton
I saw action in Algiers
Oh we must be doin' somethin' right
To last 200 years.

I pray my sons won't go to war
But if they must, they must.
I share our country's motto
And in God I place my trust.
We may have had our ups and downs
Our times of trials and fears.
But we must be doin' somethin' right
To last 200 years.

I've lived through two depressions
And seven Dust Bowl droughts
Floods, locusts and tornadoes
But I don't have any doubts.
We're all a part of history
Why Old Glory waves to show
How far along we've come 'til now
How far we've got to go.

It's been hard work but every time
We get into a fix
Let's think of what our children faced
In two - ought - seven - six.
It's up to us, to pave the way
With our blood and sweat and tears.
For we must be doin' somethin' right
To last 200 years.

~ From the movie Nashville

It was written about the US. DMOZ hasn't been around 200 years, of course, and it is an explicitly global organization, so we can't be so nationalistic. But the sentiment is the same.
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Old 02-10-2005   #16
meechp123
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I'm sorry.....what?
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Old 02-10-2005   #17
St0n3y
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Uh, yeah.... ok!
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Old 02-10-2005   #18
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>they need to overhaul the quality of sites,

Have a look around all the directories for the category that a site about mesothelioma would go in. DMOZ (and a couple of other ones) is the only one that does not list the spammy lawyer sites. Who has the problem with quality?

BTW - check the quality of some of the sites of the DMOZ bashers in numerous threads in numerous forums who complain about not getting listed :-) ... who has a problem with quality?

>improve communicaiton with submitters

Why? DMOZ is not in business of providing a service to submitters. I think you have a major misunderstanding of what DMOZ is and for.

>improve the search

Why? DMOZ is a directory, not a search engine. You browse directories and search using search engines. The DMOZ search works perfectly well at finding categories associated with a keyword - whats wrong with that? The search function at DMOZ is not very good at finding specific sites, but why would it want to? - DMOZ IS NOT A SEARCH ENGINE

>and start to think about how they are perceived within this industry.

You mean perceived by the industry that spams DMOZ, submits multiple times to DMOZ to multiple categories with deep links with sites that are not worthy of listing or with keyword stuffed descriptions and titles and create so much extra work for editors? Who cares how they perceive DMOZ - no amount of thinking by DMOZ is going to change that.

Its funny, that no matter how many times DMOZ editors explain in forums and elsewhere to clarify what DMOZ is and is not, the bashers, haters and ranters still paint a 'picture' of DMOZ of what they think it is, then set about bashing and criticizing that 'picture'. Its funny as they are bashing the wrong 'picture'. .... its a common flawed tactic used in debates - ie characterize the 'target' as something that its not, then attack that characertization.

>I see so much hate posts about DMOZ

In the last year or so, I have listed >200 sites that were never submitted or were listed with a day of being submitted. If all those were to post a thank you around the forums, they would far outweigh what you call as 'hate posts' from people who like to pretend that DMOZ is something that its not. Almost all of the ~200 or so probably have no idea of what SEO is or that these sorts forums exist.

BTW - I have asked this many times in many forums - please show me one post or complaint about DMOZ from one person from the group that DMOZ is made for ---- no one has yet been able to show me one ... DMOZ is not there as some sort of free listing service for webmasters - most of your so-called 'hate posts' are from those who want some sort of free listing service - a lot of other directories provide that service. I find it kinda laughable that so many people complain a service that is not even provided by DMOZ!!!

Last edited by cbp : 02-10-2005 at 05:23 PM.
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Old 02-10-2005   #19
krisval
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My original post was to suggest ways to IMPROVE DMOZ. It wasn't to bash it. However, I will answer the following comments.

Quote:
who has a problem with quality?
I do as do many others. Example: There are two major publisher "savings" sites who have original content and are two extremely high traffic properties. These were listed, but got delisted for some reason. They fully comply according to the terms. If the directory is supposed to be for users and not webmasters, these two sites should be listed. I know of a number of examples and none of them are my sites.

Quote:
Why? DMOZ is not in business of providing a service to submitters.
Every organization - For profit, non-profit, whatever should try its best to facilitate good will to everyone they come into contact with.

[quote]Why? DMOZ is a directory, not a search engine[quote]
What would About.com be like if it didn't have a good site search function?

Quote:
You mean perceived by the industry that spams DMOZ
Perceived on a wide basis by a lot of people in this industry.

Quote:
I think you have a major misunderstanding of what DMOZ is and for.
We all know its intentions, but if you asked your mom, dad, wife, husband, beer buddy if they have ever heard of DMOZ. They'd probably say no. I bet if you set up a poll, you would find that most of the people who actually go to www. dmoz .com directly are people in the web business. Most people would simply use a search engine or Yellow Page Directory.

Last thought....I thought that a lot of your comments seemd slighting. I could be mistaken, but I recommend that you read this post:
http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/...ead.php?t=3431

Last edited by krisval : 02-10-2005 at 07:21 PM.
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Old 02-10-2005   #20
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My original post was to suggest ways to IMPROVE DMOZ.
It may well have been, but it was based on your perception of DMOZ being something that its not.
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