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Old 02-07-2005   #1
jorock
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I heard Google needs more examples of 302 hijacking

A good source told me that Google only got a few examples of the 302 hijacking problem. Not enough to fix it.

I'd like to compile a list of examples.
Document the whole thing.
help them fix it.

You can't search for inurl:tracker2.php
It must be tripping a denial of service filter.
( NO, I don't think google is intentionally doing this, side effect of omething else. )

resend them to Google, or sticky me and I'll put it together.

Please keep this to just facts.
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Old 02-08-2005   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorock
A good source told me that Google only got a few examples of the 302 hijacking problem. Not enough to fix it.
We've had GoogleGuy bleating for examples on many issues in the past.

For me, it always beggers belief that such a large profitable company cannot resolve issues like this internally: and quickly. Perhaps if they focused resources a little more on search, and a little less on bells & whistles, they might produce a better product.

It also convinces me that the quality of the staff there isn't actually what most people think.

Regardless, best of luck collecting them. It's surely a disgrace that such a major issue has gone unresolved for so long.
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Old 02-08-2005   #3
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Maybe someone should set up a porn inspidered domain name and 302 Google's home page. Do you think that would get their attention?
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Old 02-08-2005   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s0s
We've had GoogleGuy bleating for examples on many issues in the past.

For me, it always beggers belief that such a large profitable company cannot resolve issues like this internally: and quickly. Perhaps if they focused resources a little more on search, and a little less on bells & whistles, they might produce a better product.

It also convinces me that the quality of the staff there isn't actually what most people think.

Regardless, best of luck collecting them. It's surely a disgrace that such a major issue has gone unresolved for so long.
There unfortunately is no fix that can permanently stop this happening right now as there are so many different variables invovled and they keep changing.
Google wants as many examples as they can find to further refine the filtering they have. They need people to say hey here is my site and it is hijacked. Without a complaint they do not know what to look at.
To expect them to have people go through the 8 billion pages would be a bit much.
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Old 02-08-2005   #5
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I know for a FACT that google has received several hundred examples of 302 hijacking.

All that really needs to happen is for google to make this a priority.

By Googleguys own admission, the folks at the googleplex do not see 302 hijacking as a problem. Until google sees this as a problem, it is not going to be fixed.
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Old 02-08-2005   #6
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I don't fully understand how the 302 redirect hijacking thing works. I described a problem with my site here:

http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/...ead.php?t=4035

Short version: Google traffic to my PR6 site dropped by 90% on December 17 and has remained there ever since. Doing the "inurl" search at Google shows many pages incorporating my site's domain and redirecting to my site.

Would my case be an example to send to Google Guy?
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Old 02-08-2005   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lots0
All that really needs to happen is for google to make this a priority.
Exactly! Just like M$ and their security dodgy software, they have the resources to fix it, but choose not to, on a simple prioritization basis.

You're way off reality there AussieWebmaster. Some issues are more commercial than technical. This is one of them.

If it was hurting Google financially, rather than innocent webmasters, it would be fixed within a week.
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Old 02-08-2005   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s0s
Exactly! Just like M$ and their security dodgy software, they have the resources to fix it, but choose not to, on a simple prioritization basis.

You're way off reality there AussieWebmaster. Some issues are more commercial than technical. This is one of them.

If it was hurting Google financially, rather than innocent webmasters, it would be fixed within a week.
Actually I think there is a middle ground of our realities - I agree the financials are a factor but a few hundred examples is nothing in terms of an 8 billion page database... and if that is all that come forward then maybe it is not that big of a problem and it is far easier for them to address it on a one to one basis as opposed to sidetracking programming teams to it. If there are thousands then they might act.
True they have dragged their feet a little on other cost helping projects... but once you grow to a certain size the sheer act of changing duties is not as easy as it seems... most people are juggling multiple projects and to have them stop and move on this in any speedy fashion is not just going to happen in a large way.
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Old 02-08-2005   #9
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It adds a random quality to the results. Top sites are targetted, they get hijacked, they go down, next round goes the same way..

Call it a rotation feature.
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Old 02-08-2005   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kedazle
I don't fully understand how the 302 redirect hijacking thing works. I described a problem with my site here:

http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/...ead.php?t=4035

Short version: Google traffic to my PR6 site dropped by 90% on December 17 and has remained there ever since. Doing the "inurl" search at Google shows many pages incorporating my site's domain and redirecting to my site.

Would my case be an example to send to Google Guy?
Yes. Send it in.
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Old 02-08-2005   #11
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So much for sticking to the facts

Was this problem over-estimated?
Is it hundreds of sites, or thousands of sites?

if it's thousands, they need to be sent to Google.

Please only post with confirmations it happened to you, or confirmations you sent something.

Let's try to get accurate figures.
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Old 02-08-2005   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AussieWebmaster
but a few hundred examples is nothing in terms of an 8 billion page database... and if that is all that come forward then maybe it is not that big of a problem
And you really believe that a company like Google should decide whether to act on the basis of responses to a handful of messages from an employee (in this case GoogleGuy) at WMW and a couple of other places?

Interesting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AussieWebmaster
Actually I think there is a middle ground of our realities
Not really. One determines and drives the other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AussieWebmaster
... the sheer act of changing duties ...
And Google doesn't have a team charged with monitoring and addressing SERP quality? With a significant range of (search) database analysis tools at its disposal? Do you really believe that this isn't the case?

If it isn't, Google's in even worse shape than many people think. If it is, maybe they should direct these resources at a problem which is hurting people. Oops.. forgot: there's no profit in it for them is there.
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Old 02-08-2005   #13
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maybe this is why googlebot wont visit my site?

allinurl for commodity-trading-software . com

Shows:

http://www.speedtrader.com/dirinc/cl...are.com&id=746

Which is a 302 redirect to my site when viewing the header?

Thanks
Frank
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Old 02-08-2005   #14
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how did Yahoo fix it? I'm curious?
I don't remember them saying that they need samples, they just fixed it by adjusting how a 302 was counted as. If Google wants to fix they can, if not they will use this an excuse for years. It has already been over 6 months .

Last edited by ThouShaltSeo : 02-09-2005 at 12:37 AM.
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Old 02-09-2005   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s0s
And you really believe that a company like Google should decide whether to act on the basis of responses to a handful of messages from an employee (in this case GoogleGuy) at WMW and a couple of other places?

Interesting.
No I said they should deal with them as they come in... there are more people than just GG making changes.

Quote:
And Google doesn't have a team charged with monitoring and addressing SERP quality? With a significant range of (search) database analysis tools at its disposal? Do you really believe that this isn't the case?

If it isn't, Google's in even worse shape than many people think. If it is, maybe they should direct these resources at a problem which is hurting people. Oops.. forgot: there's no profit in it for them is there.
I thought GG was left in charge... no wait a sec you suggested that above.
Has the possibility that this has not been quickly addressed as in many cases they come from those companies people hire to create web pages for them to get cheaper clicks not knowing this could happen?

Last edited by dannysullivan : 02-10-2005 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 02-09-2005   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inthedark
maybe this is why googlebot wont visit my site?

allinurl for commodity-trading-software . com

Shows:

http://www.speedtrader.com/dirinc/cl...are.com&id=746

Which is a 302 redirect to my site when viewing the header?

Thanks
Frank
Looks like it, have you sent this to Google?
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Old 02-09-2005   #17
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I don’t understand why anyone would defend google (or anyone/anything) for not fixing a problem, a problem that is hurting some and can be corrected fairly easily.
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Old 02-09-2005   #18
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Originally Posted by lots0
I don’t understand why anyone would defend google (or anyone/anything) for not fixing a problem, a problem that is hurting some and can be corrected fairly easily.
Indeed. But it's Google isn't it: many people seem to love to turn a blind eye to their faults.

In this particular scenario there simply is no defence or legitimate excuse. This should have been fixed long ago, but as I pointed out, it's only people that are suffering here, and not Google's bottom line. Hence the relative disinterest.

Last edited by dannysullivan : 02-10-2005 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 02-09-2005   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s0s
Indeed. But it's Google isn't it: many people seem to love to turn a blind eye to their faults.

The guy above joins an incredibly long list of people who simply knee jerk to their defence, whatever the scenario.

In this particular scenario there simply is no defence or legitimate excuse. This should have been fixed long ago, but as I pointed out, it's only people that are suffering here, and not Google's bottom line. Hence the relative disinterest.


No, I'm just one of those strange people who can see the truth when it stares me in the face. I point out the facts - which certainly beats the hell out of grovelling pointlessly to a ruthless entity whose corporate motives become ever more one dimensional by the day.
I want them to fix it before I get hit by it, call it preventive medicine.
I guess nobody wants them to fix it, a few hundred reports, out of 8 billion documents isn't a problem.
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Old 02-09-2005   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jorock
Looks like it, have you sent this to Google?
yes, I sent an email but just received an automated response that there is nothing a comptetitor can do to harm my listings...(if I had any, lol)

I doubt that this is the problem as I put the site up in December, have been listed in DMOZ and Yahoo dir since then and have 100's of links per Yahoo and MSN yet googlebot never visits...really an odd situation and probably a unique issue

thanks
Frank
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