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Old 01-17-2008   #1
Jazajay
 
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Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

Hi all I have noticed, since xmas, that when I do a search using the address bar or Google toolbar on FF it times out ruffly 50% of the time and I have to click try again to get to the results, also when I click off the SERPS to the site it times out around 15% of the time.

I was just wondering if any one else has noticed the same thing. I use FF 2.12 (the latest version any way) and I was wondering if it was a problem with FF or with G.

I reckon FF but was just checking before I submit another bug report.
Cheers for reading
Jaz
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Old 01-17-2008   #2
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

we have had problems with gmail and now blocking from Google for our searches... am planning an article on it for today
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Old 01-17-2008   #3
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

I have just upgraded to vista so was thinking it could be that but fair enough.
I was just about to say I haven't I had a problem with gmail but had to try again when I clicked through to here - typical.

O well at least it won't bog down the moz team with a useless report.
Cheers
Jaz
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Old 01-17-2008   #4
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

I'm noticing G analytics taking quite some time to load on many sites across the board, especially on SEW yesterday.
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Old 01-17-2008   #5
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

GMail has been playing up for quite some time... and getting progressively worse
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Old 01-17-2008   #6
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

OK now I know it's down to G and not external applications such as FF I may have a reason why. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ok it gets slightly techie so I'll try to make it easier for the non geeks among us .

So if we take the fact that G is timing out / web page is slower it's down to their servers - obviously.

I suggested this could happen in another thread, about 2 weeks ago didn't think it actually could due to the fact G will have a lot of staff to make sure this wont happen for very good reasons.

G uses the horizontal scailing method when it comes to web server distribution and maintance. (Well at least a few months ago they still where).

Whats horizontal scailing?
Well if you run your own servers there are 2 methods to use them.
1. Vertical scailing (Most used unless you are Live,G, yahoo/flicker etc..)
This is where you have several huge severs - enterprise level you are talking something similar to the Sun Fire E25K. (72 processors and upto a massive 576GB of RAM not even in my price range couldn't even justify the cost, the average computer runs 1 processor and 1GB of RAM to put it into prospective). O Marcia if you want to get me a Xmas present next year, hopefully I'll be back on the list that would be nice.

However this isn't good for G for many reasons
1. Location - The speed of the G website and delivery of SERPS would be slower the further you are away from the server(s) not suitable for Asia, Africa and even Europe would notice a hit if they where situated in the states.

2. Imagine what would happen if they lost power in that location for 2 weeks - G would be off line.

However upgrading and maintance would be cheaper, It would require fewer staff etc...

So they go down the root of
2.Horizontal Scailing

This is where instead of several massive servers with a few staff.
You have thousands of littler severs distributed around the world. This requires more staff, space and maintaince but it makes sense they run it like this.

This way they need a few servers in each region - the word few is down to interpretation of your web sites needs.
For example 1 or 2 in the UK that supplies UK searchs maybe 1 per US state or 1 per every other state for those people requesting results. 1 for France for Frence searchs etc.... (Very very very Simplified example you could take 1 and multiply it a lot again down to indiviual regions needs).

Now the problem may be down to a massive increase in bottlenecks however I don't think so, I'll get to that in a min.

Whats a Bottleneck?
A bottleneck is where you have an application it can be your website application, web server or your bowl movement every morning, which isn't performing at maximum capacity hence the neck of a bottle more drink going through a smaller space. This could be the reason. As in there system cant handle an increased in searches so is choking and timing out. Refresh you go back in the que and get processed again (again simplified).

However I'm not sure due to how their servers are set up. This would only be localized as in just in Britain or NY chances are slim both would be effected at the same time as it would mean a massive increase in bottlenecks over 2 completely independent web servers. However it is a possibility, unlikely but still a possibility. That said if you walk at the same position into a wall for a million years there is still a possibility you could walk right through the wall but thats another subject. Something like 1 in a billion billion billion.... -Still possible though.

There is a way we at SEW can determine this are people experiencing this out side of the UK and New York? as jimbeetle and aussie are both in New York, and myself in Sunny UK, it makes sense for them to be experiencing the same issue.

What about any one from Irleand, Texas, Califronia, Florida, Spain, Germany, India, Australia etc.. Is it the same for you guys? - it may not be.

If you do post please specify your country of origin / state and what's up. Please only 1 per country. HA

If it's accross the board however it can only be down to
1. either bottlenecks accross many independent servers,

2. A world wide upgrade maybe to accommodate some new algo change or increase in efficiency. However I cant see it taking this long to update them all. due to the fact that each cluster should have there own team to look after them therefore making updates easier to manage as you don't have one team flying from location to location making updates.

3. A possible problem with their DB and a massive lag in sending the info - unlikely a simple search for hello just came up at around 500 000 results in0.10 secs.

4. Another problem that only the guys at G no about, that they haven't divulged about their server configuration, maybe a breach in protocol virus effecting widewide systems as they will probably be networked so a worm could filter down. (No evidence of this just a possibility).

5. A sudden surge in traffic that they weren't expecting and as a result there servers cant cope. Does any one have any recent data from G (last month) about % of search amount of searches each month. Again this varys from country to country so it would have to be a universal increase. for it to effect multiple servers.

6. Hackers hitting at once causing the worst DOS - Dinal of service -ever.
Again unlikely the worst reported case to my knowledge was 2000/2001 when one hacker and the power of 150 000 computers, gained via a worm, brought yahoo, amazon I think ebay down for 4 hours on a Monday morning.

Company like that down for an hour would lose around US $10,000 at least in 2005.

Again could account for a lag as in system resources all getting used up. Again would have to be dedicated people using a lot of computers world wide to cause that problem. Higher chance of an infection than this.

7. A recent exploit found in G or Gmail which in turns effects the other one - I haven't heard of anything and I get around 180 - 300 exploits a day. If it was broadcast on shawl we say less scupiable sites out there it could account for a lot of hackers world wide hitting them at once.

8. Something I cant think of

It has to be the servers due to the problem in web page times gmail would be on the same servers so would the analytics I would imagine. However Utube doesn't seem to be experiencing any problems. Could be isolated from G's other servers. Not sure.

If I was going to hazard a logical guess and please take this as a logical guess - in my opinion the only thing that could effect that many servers all at once in so many geographical locations that are all connected via a network would be a virus or more probably a worm filtering down through their system. It would have to be a tricky git for it to still be causing issues though. -Again my assumption.

Last edited by Jazajay : 01-17-2008 at 02:31 PM. Reason: Odd word here and there
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Old 01-17-2008   #7
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

And I am also now being blocked as spyware bot when doing searches on Google... too many people from one place uses it... we have 500 people in the office in NY so we look like one big bot
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Old 01-17-2008   #8
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

We can handle lots of people coming from one IP; AussieWebmaster, it could be that someone in your office has some malware that is scraping Google or otherwise hitting us hard.
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Old 01-17-2008   #9
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

Okay thanks for the heads up... now I will do the witch hunt through our office.... so anyone down on wall street will recognize the torches blazing moving around 1 Financial Square
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Old 01-17-2008   #10
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

Because you know we are not doing anything stupid on my watch
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Old 01-17-2008   #11
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazajay View Post
I have just upgraded to vista so was thinking it could be that but fair enough.
Jazajay,

"upgraded" and "vista" shouldn't be used in the same sentence. Stop crying and get a mac!

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Old 01-18-2008   #12
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Re: Any one notice that G is timeing out a lot recently

Quote:
"upgraded" and "vista" shouldn't be used in the same sentence. Stop crying and get a mac!

I would if I wanted to relie on a dieing piece of equipment that costs a lot more to upgrade and fix and a lot more time to wait to have the parts shipped to me!

Also the parts are easier to break as I have fat fingers and bad hand eye cordination thats why i'm a programmer and not a marketer - you can get large keyboard keys but large pens just look stupid in meetings.

Are you bullying me again Bue

True I upgraded to vista after they fixed all the security issues had it a week an an incompatible program made my legal version of windows invalid. O How abusive I got on thier forum. You think I post long threads here. They fixed the issue and released an update within 48 hours.
Now it's valid again - lucky me.
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