Search Engine Watch
SEO News

Go Back   Search Engine Watch Forums > General Search Issues > SEM Related Organizations & Events
FAQ Members List Calendar Forum Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-22-2007   #1
glengara
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Done Leery
Posts: 1,118
glengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud of
Conferences - Ripping us off?

Went to my first one yesterday, apart from the likes of G/Y!/MSN people had PAID to give "presentations"!

If this is common practice for the likes of SES/PubCon are the paying customers being taken for a ride?

Last edited by glengara : 03-22-2007 at 05:38 PM.
glengara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #2
evilgreenmonkey
 
evilgreenmonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: London, UK
Posts: 703
evilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud of
Appearance fees are uncommon at the likes of SES and PubCon, although are sometimes used to attract speakers (especially Key Note speakers) who will bring in more paying customers.

Micro conferences are a different matter though, these will usually either offer a share in all profits or a fixed attendance fee to the main speakers. This is because the speakers are in most cases expected to give away information that they may not have at a larger conference.
evilgreenmonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #3
projectphp
What The World, Needs Now, Is Love, Sweet Love
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 449
projectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to behold
No evilgreenmonkey, if you read his post he said the PRESENTERS PAID for the right to speak.

I am sure it isn't uncommon, but neither is it the norm on average.
projectphp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #4
evilgreenmonkey
 
evilgreenmonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: London, UK
Posts: 703
evilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud of
I'm going crazy, sorry about that. Never heard of this before - at a search conference anyhow.
evilgreenmonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #5
evilgreenmonkey
 
evilgreenmonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: London, UK
Posts: 703
evilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud of
Quote:
So are speaking engagements by invitation only, or could I buy my way to a SES/PubCon engagement?
You can't buy your way onto SES, either in the form of a pay-off or getting a PR agency to big you up. I'm not sure about Pubcon as I haven't had much to do with it (not a big WMW fan personally - mostly because of the forum software).

Last edited by evilgreenmonkey : 03-22-2007 at 06:21 PM.
evilgreenmonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #6
glengara
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Done Leery
Posts: 1,118
glengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud of
I'm pretty sure reading about SES looking for possible presenters for past conferences, but not whether any fees were involved either way...
glengara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #7
evilgreenmonkey
 
evilgreenmonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: London, UK
Posts: 703
evilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud ofevilgreenmonkey has much to be proud of
Quote:
Originally Posted by glengara
I'm pretty sure reading about SES looking for possible presenters for past conferences, but not whether any fees were involved either way...
Pitching for a place on a session panel is open to anyone, new proposals are invited for all of the conferences. The people with the best (or previously successful) presentation will end up speaking. If you're interested in speaking at a future SES conference, the SES Blog is where the requests for speakers are posted.



Rob
evilgreenmonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #8
glengara
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Done Leery
Posts: 1,118
glengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud ofglengara has much to be proud of
I think I'd prefer presenters to be be paid to speak on a particular topic, expecting presenters to both carry the cost AND not turn it into a sales pitch is an expectation too far, IMO....
glengara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #9
Chris Boggs
 
Chris Boggs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Near Cleveland, OH
Posts: 1,722
Chris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud ofChris Boggs has much to be proud of
shoot I think I paid Danny $39.63 for my first slot.
Chris Boggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #10
Joseph Morin
 
Joseph Morin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 655
Joseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of light
DISCLAIMER: Danny paid me 1 British pound for my role as "Official SES Party Coordinator" last year while we were at a pub in London.

If you look at the Speaker proposal and pitch guidlines you'll see how SES specifically frowns on pitches within the presentations and they typically dont pay speakers.

I'm also one of the conference organizers for PubCon and other than our keynote speakers, we don't pay speakers either although I know we have reimbursed some expenses for exceptional travel and have similar policies regarding pitches during presentations. If we get complaints - then the speakers arent invited back and that is typically revealed during the session evaluations - these are provided during both SES and PubCon so make sure you cast your evaluations to ensure the quality of the conferences.

Last edited by Joseph Morin : 03-22-2007 at 09:51 PM.
Joseph Morin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #11
ExposureTim
TimDineen
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Stamford, CT
Posts: 166
ExposureTim will become famous soon enough
Quote:
shoot I think I paid Danny $39.63 for my first slot.
LOL

Quote:
If you look at the Speaker proposal and pitch guidlines you'll see how SES specifically frowns on pitches within the presentations and they typically dont pay speakers.
In my limited experience at past SES conferences, the presenters talk plenty about themselves and the companies they represent. That's not necessarily a bad thing as I, at the time, wanted to hear their pitches.

But I'm not sure that it's really fair to say that just the fact that they officially frown upon pitches actually results in the lack of pitches no matter that the guidelines have actually been typed by someone and posted to a web page (that no one would read if you hadn't linked to it).
ExposureTim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2007   #12
Marcia
 
Marcia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,476
Marcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond reputeMarcia has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Boggs
shoot I think I paid Danny $39.63 for my first slot.
Yeah, well I got paid to NOT speak.
Marcia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #13
dazzlindonna
Internet Entrepreneur
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Franklinton, LA, USA
Posts: 91
dazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of light
Let's just pretend that speakers were paid for a moment. How would doing so = ripping us off? I just don't see the connection between paid presentations and ripping off the attendees. I understand that speakers pitching their products without giving "value added content" within their presentations would be a bad thing. (Like how I threw that SEO spam/thin affiliate metaphor in there?)

But just paying speakers doesn't equate to attendees being ripped off in my mind. The speakers, after all, draw attendees to the conference. Without them, the conferences would have far fewer attendees. The attendees pay to attend. The conference owners receive payment. Seems to me that speakers should get a cut of that since they are drawing attendees. Basic business, in my opinion.

In this world of "we want everything to be free and open source", we sometimes forget that money still must change hands in order to keep ourselves fed, clothed, and housed.

I've never been a speaker, so I don't have any ulterior motives here, but I personally think speakers should be compensated for their expenses and time. Just my opinion, though.
dazzlindonna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #14
Mel66
Oversees: Google AdWords
 
Mel66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 775
Mel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud ofMel66 has much to be proud of
Wait, wasn't glengara saying the speakers paid for the privilege of speaking? That's different than accepting payment to be a speaker.

To me, paying to speak is akin to paying to exhibit - it's like a "booth fee" to tout your wares. I like the SES setup where there aren't as many sales pitches as you find at other conferences. My opinion, anyway.

Melissa
Mel66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #15
dazzlindonna
Internet Entrepreneur
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Franklinton, LA, USA
Posts: 91
dazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of lightdazzlindonna is a glorious beacon of light
Ah, if I misunderstood, then I withdraw my comments. That's what I get for reading before my second cup of coffee in the morning.
dazzlindonna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #16
Joseph Morin
 
Joseph Morin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 655
Joseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of lightJoseph Morin is a glorious beacon of light
To clarify: At both SES and PubCon, we don't accept payment FROM speakers either. The speakers are chosen by merit and their knowledge of the subject matter as a an expert in a particular niche.
Joseph Morin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #17
projectphp
What The World, Needs Now, Is Love, Sweet Love
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 449
projectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to beholdprojectphp is a splendid one to behold
And yet many also pay for booths, no?

Who cares really? A conference costs money to put on. If the speakers help with costs, so be it. Quality, not the perception of such, is the key.
projectphp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #18
egain
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lancashire, UK
Posts: 134
egain is on a distinguished road
Not having presented at any of the conferences, if one was asked to speak at one of the bigger conferences and had to pay, I would imagine, the ROI attributable to putting a good presentation together would still be positive, however will highlight thats purely a guestimate, and I guess would be dictated by the quality/type of attendess.
egain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #19
sportsguy
Just another in-house SEM guy...
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 161
sportsguy is a jewel in the roughsportsguy is a jewel in the roughsportsguy is a jewel in the rough
Interesting thread. ...it's giving me a headache, though...

I speak at SES shows. I do not get paid. (...am I missing out??? LOL)

Speakers do get a spanky ribbon added to their conference pass, though - that's GOT to be worth something...

I'd personally never pay to be allowed to speak somewhere. I mean, if one of the largest topic-focused conferences around, like SES for example, doesn't "charge" speakers to speak, then it's got to say something.

Man, that's just an odd concept in my mind, I guess.

I consider it a privilege to be invited to speak, I take it seriously and follow the rules. Not pitching come easy, though, when you're speaking on In-House matters as an In-House person... Not like I'm LOOKING for YOUR work, too...
sportsguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2007   #20
Elisabeth
 
Elisabeth's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: the wasatch front
Posts: 987
Elisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to beholdElisabeth is a splendid one to behold
Ok, late to the party here, but interesting topic.

It's definitely common in one aspect of the conference planning world to pay for your spot to pitch your product.

So, yes, as an attendee, you go to one of those sessions expecting to truly learn something, and don't - I can see why someone would go to something like that (regardless of who the pitchers are) and feel ripped off. I tend to put these in the categories of EXPOs. Organizers gain from having content generated, presenters gain from peddling their wares/gaining exposures. this happens in many different industries, not just search.

I think it's been fairly well established that SES, Pubcon in particular don't truly operate this way. (aside from some travel expenses, appearance fees, etc)

That's because these two are more educational series than expos.

Glengara, the problem here is that you seem to be lumping in whatever it is you attended with "all" SEM conferences or organizations, but that's defintely not the case, though event formats may vary as this industry continues to grow. However, there are plenty of shows/seminars that are set up this way. So it's buyer beware really.

Last edited by Elisabeth : 03-23-2007 at 04:21 PM.
Elisabeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off