Is Every SEO, SEM, PPC Professional Employed?

[cryptblade]

I've gotten a lot of recruiters calling or emailing me with information. I've tried to reach out - Twitter, LinkedIn connects - to pass the job opportunities along, but no bites!

My church recently held a job fair/job finding skills forum. Plenty of people looking for work - but no one with real qualifications.

the medical field seems to be doing well enough - but I hear grumblings about hours cut. Nurses, for example, are still employed and can find employment but their hours are cut, forcing them to find additional nursing jobs. that might crowd out the market for new comers. Not that that matters anyway because the new comers need to have proper education.

As for SEO, PPC, and SEM, the skills required are so interdisciplinary, it's conceivable that people from different backgrounds can enter. Yet I don't see too many people biting.


Are all SEOs, SEMs, and PPCs happily employed???

[AussieWebmaster]

could be the location... some places have fewer online marketers than others

[cryptblade]

maybe - but I send out feelers on LinkedIn and Twitter, in my network. They expand beyond just the east coast.

[Discovery]

It's my biased opinion that all SEM's who work for themselves are happily employed.

Working for others, well, that's a mixed bag.

With the barrier to entry being soooo low to run your own marketing, seo, sem service, or to apply your knowledge in selling a product or service yourself, why in the world would you do it for another company and give them the bulk of the profits?

Answer: People find security in "having a job".

Well as we all know, having a job in the States is a false sense of security.

[Mel66]

Also a lot of the hiring companies want local candidates only - they won't consider telecommuting or virtual options. Sorry, but a lot of us are not willing to uproot our families and move, especially when SEM can be done from just about anywhere (as many of us can attest to). Job postings with "local candidates only" in the description are off-putting.

[Discovery]

After Mel's response, I'll back track just a bit.

Sometimes folks just want a part time employment that will not disrupt their current lifestyle.. An at home parent is a perfect example. Running their own business takes up too much time thus working for another company who can handle the overhead is a worthwhile tradeoff for the additional income with "no strings" attached.

In these cases, it's critical to find a company that gets it.
No telecommuting for a position as an SEM, SEO? The company clearly does not get it. One day a week in office meeting, or a video call.. thats all good, but 60 hours in-house? What a waste. Do these companies like to pay for commute time, coffee and smoke breaks?

I remember back in 1998 when companies were asking for 10 years experience as a webmaster. And others that rated your success by how many "hits" you drove to your websites - not visitors but hits from your log file! Add a few hundred images anyone? These companies were out of touch.

Stay away from these companies and keep searching until you find one that gets it.

[lazworld]

We are in business 11 years and busy.

[AussieWebmaster]

Obviously not everyone is fully employed but are you willing to use people that telecommute?

[cryptblade]

Actually, I'm not the one doing any hiring - but I get a lot of recruiters calling me up or emailing me. Some are good. Some are bad. It's not that I particularly care to help out these recruiters - they are sales people after all and I would be doing them a favor.

And yes, running your own business and being your own boss can and is great. But as all business owners and self-employed can attest, it IS a lot of work - and it is much easier to find a job that pays just as well without all the hassles of being a boss.

A former supervisor and friend of mine was like that. He wanted a job, wanted to get away from the pressures of being a boss. He had his own company - as I understood it, he was up and down with it. And with all of that, it was easier to get a job. But his calling is to be a business owner and he went out and started another company.

Just as you say it's easy to enter the field on your own, let's be realistic. How do you generate your own sales? As your own boss, you become your biggest sales person. And not everyone is cut out to do that. So it becomes easier to work for another company.

There are plenty of good SEO firms out there to work for - and plenty of ad agencies with a digital division that will employ SEOs and PPCs - and pay good wages with good benefits.

I do see your point about not picking up and move. A few people I've emailed or talked to were not willing to move, so yes, that is a consideration.

Nothing like collecting a paycheck and working on your own SEO projects, part-time (your own stores or SEO blog for example).

But none of this is my point. The point is, with the economy the way it is, and people losing jobs elsewhere, I thought there would be more SEOs and PPCs looking. But apparently, most seem happily employed. That or else my reach isn't very far.

Either way, I'm of the mindset that if I'm blessed with employment and I can help others, I'd like to do that. But no biters.

[cryptblade]

There's a part of me that thinks now that Search is "evangelized" as a necessary component of marketing and advertising, we as an industry and professional collective need to evangelize the skill sets necessary for success in this industry.

I've seen discombobulated attempts by various individuals to list skills needed to be an SEO, etc. But let's be honest here - not everyone is so interdisciplinary and not everyone company needs a full SEO.

I have found that working with any company that has more than 1 employee, it's best to have an internal SEO evangelist or SEO champion. Typically this is a marketer.

In fact, the best SEOs are marketers because they get it. They get that SEO's real use is to help with website traffic and sales. And if they are really visionary, they get that SEO can help with branding and reputation as well.

Sometimes you get an IT person who gets it as well.

But my experience is that an IT person and a marketing person both think differently and probably have different department goals or results that they must meet.

I have also found that SEO sales is something that needs to be revamped tremendously. Too many SEOs sell like snakeoil salesmen. It's true. I think that does this industry a disservice. Not enough professional salespeople in this industry and the sales people who are in the industry, not enough of them get it.

Part of me thinks that all of this is really part of a SEO firm's proprietary or competitive secret. But part of me thinks that there's room for improvement and that as an industry, we should now evangelize different SEO HR roles.

[AussieWebmaster]

there is always a need for someone inside a company to have an evangelist to make sure the company site gets optimized

[cryptblade]

Originally Posted by Discovery

Answer: People find security in "having a job".

Well as we all know, having a job in the States is a false sense of security.

But most people are not gifted enough to run their own business. They may be able to run a hustle - but their own business is a different case.

I even have former bosses who really should not be bosses at all. They don't know, don't have the vision for real business leadership. They are accidental bosses. So being your own boss isn't necessarily a sure thing - and having a job IS a bit of security.

[Discovery]

Crypt I understand what you're saying, but I guess I'm a bit strong headed on this issue. When it comes to Internet based businesses and services for the most part it comes down to pure motivation. Starting up a medical practice costs hard cash, hiring employees, and many other fixed costs to invest in. I understand that this requires a great deal of effort and risk that a doctor would not want to take on.

Online marketing?
If you're a proven online marketer then you should have no problem starting and growing an online business... IF you have the motivation.

Yes there are leaders and followers. I think inately most successful online business owners, developers and such are leaders. (With an uncanny ability to follow other online leaders!)

In relation to the economy. I think this is very localized. Southern California is doing just fine. No we have not hit bottom yet as inflation, commercial real estate nor credit card debt has exploded. When it does this may change, but right now the restaurants are full, the golf courses packed and the movies sold out. There are few if any for sale signs and you still can't purchase a small home for under 400k. I do not know one person who has been layed off. I know this is different for places like Michigan or the South East, but in So Cal life is fairly normal.

[cryptblade]

Originally Posted by Discovery

Online marketing?
If you're a proven online marketer then you should have no problem starting and growing an online business... IF you have the motivation.

That's still the problem isn't it? IF you have it. When you're running your own business, sales becomes your main function. And if someone is just "dabbling" in their own thing, it's not really running a business. I dabble in web design. It's a side hustle. It's not a real business -yet.

But, for all those who think they can run their own show, let's face it, at least 90% can't. Plus, you and I both know that lots of people say they know SEO but really don't. and they are definitely not good enough to be an SEO on their own.

Point is, there are jobs out there in this industry. But if the consensus is that everyone is employed then OK, everyone is employed. If the consensus is, well, in NY and the east coast, SEOs are employed but not so much in Utah or Ohio, then OK, I get that too.

For myself, I personally can and will move for the right job.

Originally Posted by Discovery

Southern California is doing just fine. No we have not hit bottom yet as inflation, commercial real estate nor credit card debt has exploded. When it does this may change, but right now the restaurants are full, the golf courses packed and the movies sold out. There are few if any for sale signs and you still can't purchase a small home for under 400k. I do not know one person who has been layed off. I know this is different for places like Michigan or the South East, but in So Cal life is fairly normal.

Same way with NY. Even with the financial industry the way it is, things are still alive and well. Daily, tourists flock to the city, hit the stores and restaurants, and pack the streets. You would think it's still good times. I mean, if these are bad times, I can't imagine what really good times is like!

[AussieWebmaster]

People are looking to the future - it is a time to be there now so you have the leads for when things get better - fall behind and you will always be playing catch up.

[cryptblade]

my own opinion is that with the economy and job market the way it is, there would be more people willing to explore or break into the market. But so far - tumbleweeds...

[Discovery]

I think too often employees start their own business because they are fed up with their employer. This rarely leads to a successful business. A person who works for "the man" for a long time, builds experience and is all the while thinking someday I will launch on my own because I know I have what it takes.. that's the type who can work remotely or start their own operation. They are not risk adverse.

Then again, I was the kid with my own lemonade stand at 6, lawn mowing at 10 dragging a mower up to a mile down the road to do a lawn! landscaping maintenance through construction business at 14 -19 with up to 8 workers which paid for my college years. Even during my 10 years in corporate America I always had a side business. That business gave way to my current company which I have run for the past 10 years... all with remote employees! So perhaps my viewpoint is a bit skewed in thinking we all have an entrepreneur within us just waiting to break out.

[cryptblade]

Discovery, you are definitely skewed. I speak from a perspective where my church is full of "would-be" entrepreneurs. I had a business partner who was interested in getting glory and recognition as a "businessman" while I did all the work - building sites, meeting and networking with prospects, etc. And of those prospects, too many of them are desperate to start their own business - not because they have an idea or have a dream - because they are fed up with not making more money.

Think about how many SEO prospects you speak to who don't have a prayer of starting a business and succeeding. They don't want to put in the work, they dont want to put in time or research or understand their business, and most importantly, they don't have patience.

Your own experience is probably what most people need to go through in order to start their own business. Most people need to put in their time, learn from others, observe and decide there's a better way.

I saw that with the previous SEO companies I worked for. I wrote out a plan to make something like that much much better. But I'm also happily employed now. Few people are gifted with that midas touch of entrepreneurship.

[jag]

There are lively differences in SEO skills and employment. Some work in-house for particular industry, some work for full time SEO company and some work for web development / software company and according to me people who start with web development / software company has difference in skills and employment environment and has good learning opportunity. Once there is a growth in the skill with development pros and cons the person is qualified as professional

And mostly after few years most of the SEO person goes for their own business tacky or non-tacky and few take offers on part time employment and they are happy

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

Hey Discovery,

Online marketing?
If you're a proven online marketer then you should have no problem starting and growing an online business... IF you have the motivation.

I think the last part of it says it all. It seems like a lot of people (the majority?) simply aren't self-starters. It seems like nobody has much of a problem going to college and studying their butts off for classes they are hardly interested - because social pressures motivate them to do so. However, very few people seem to have the drive to put in a similar amount of work (or even 10% of it!) if those social pressures don't motivate (force) them to do so.

Im not trying to sound like I'm about to major in philosophy, but I think it has a lot to do with intrinsic?) motivation which is a trait some people have and many just don't. No idea, if it's mostly genetic or if some of it is learned, but some people simply seem to have a lot of "drive", "motivation", etc. but most people just don't seem to.

People dont seem to have much difficulty spending literally thousands of hours studying for college classes they aren't really interested in full-time (because social pressures motivate/force them to do it), yet when you learn something on your own (that you put say a few hundreds hours into), people look at you like you're an alien.

PS: this reminds me of a great and insightful conversation we had almost 3 years ago, when I first started learning about online marketing!:-)

LOL@ this quote from that old thread:

I recently spoke at a local university to the Marketing & Commerce students there. When I met with the prof, we reviewed the marketing text book they were using - it was printed in February of 2006.

(...) this is the exact copy that appeared on the page:

"Due to the inability to accurately track marketing campaigns in the online environment, many firms choose not to advertise in this medium at this time."

Naturally, I laughed.

This is probably the most ridiculous thing I've read in a while.