Does JavaScript=Hidden Links?

[Dr Sledge]

Hello all,
I am fairly new to the SEO landscape and I must say, it's fast-paced and exciting! But some parts are also confusing when coming at it from an essentially non-coder point of view. That said, here's my question:

Do search engines frown on using JavaScript to manipulate divs? We're using a JS library called MooFX, which I think manipulates the DOM to create effects. In our specific instance, we're using that JS to show/hide a certain div which contains links to major internal pages.

So here's my catch: Matt Cutts has hinted around that doing things like manipulating the CSS to hide text and links can look spammy and so should be avoided (here (http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/hidden-links/) and here (http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/communication-in-other-languages/)) however, does that apply to my situation? Of course we're not trying to spam anyone, but is there a chance Google would see it that way?

I did some forum searches to find posts on this and couldn't find anything, but if I missed a post that answers this question, do tell.

Thanks for everyone's help!

(wow, blind as a bat...I found a post (http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=18169/) addressing this very issue...thanks anyway!)

[beu]

Hello all,
I am fairly new to the SEO landscape and I must say, it's fast-paced and exciting! But some parts are also confusing when coming at it from an essentially non-coder point of view. That said, here's my question:

Do search engines frown on using JavaScript to manipulate divs? We're using a JS library called MooFX, which I think manipulates the DOM to create effects. In our specific instance, we're using that JS to show/hide a certain div which contains links to major internal pages.

So here's my catch: Matt Cutts has hinted around that doing things like manipulating the CSS to hide text and links can look spammy and so should be avoided (here (http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/hidden-links/) and here (http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/communication-in-other-languages/)) however, does that apply to my situation? Of course we're not trying to spam anyone, but is there a chance Google would see it that way?

I did some forum searches to find posts on this and couldn't find anything, but if I missed a post that answers this question, do tell.

Thanks for everyone's help!

(wow, blind as a bat...I found a post (http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=18169/) addressing this very issue...thanks anyway!)

If you think Google might see this as spam, I wouldn't do it! If you have content in hidden in DIV tags via an external CSS then yes, you may be spamming.

[SanDiegoSEO]

I gave my comments in the other thread:
http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?p=110722#post110722

[beu]

I gave my comments in the other thread:
http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?p=110722#post110722
Again, if you think Google might see this as spam don't do it! Be aware that links in Javascript may be inaccessible to search engines.

Here is some additional information:
"Use of Javascript is an entirely legitimate web practice. However, use of Javascript with the intent to deceive search engines is not..."

"Note that placement of links within Javascript is alone not deceptive. When examining Javascript on your site to ensure your site adheres to our guidelines, consider the intent.

Keep in mind that since search engines generally can't access the contents of Javascript, legitimate links within Javascript will likely be inaccessible to them (as well as to visitors without Javascript-enabled browsers). You might instead keep links outside of Javascript or replicate them in a noscript tag."
http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=66355

[trooperbill]

as long as the link isnt hidden in code you'll be fine

mark rushworth

[Dr Sledge]

Thanks for the feedback...and beu thanks for the link to the Webmaster Help. It seems pretty clear to me from that post about JS redirects that it is perfectly fine to do as long as your intent isn't to deceive and as long as you replicate the links in a noscript tag. We are merely using JS to display some gifs that link to other pages, so if we add a noscript tag with those links, I'm sure we'll be Ok.

Thanks for all the help!

[mlocker]

Thanks a bunch.

Michael Locker MD

[beu]

Just be sure your links are accessible and best of luck :) !

[Marcia]

Just so it's handy, here's a quote of SanDiegoSeo's post in the other thread:

I would say that, as long as you have an (easy to see) way for the user to activate the layer of text, you're going to be fine.

The engines aren't going to punish you for using a design technique the way it was created to be used. Having hidden layers and links that show those layers is very common. A layout that has a tabbed design is very common. Clicking on each tab doesnt take you to a new page, but shows a layer of text that is hidden, is very effective in both user experience as well as SEO. I use the technique on many clients and so far no bad results (and lots of rankings.)

[Marcia]

First off, that isn't something the algo is like to pick up, it would take "looking" and anyone looking at that on a page can see that it's a design feature, not anything trying to be sneaky.

Clicking on each tab doesnt take you to a new page, but shows a layer of text that is hidden, is very effective It isn't something being delivered to the search engine that's hidden from human visitors. And visitors have to click, then they can see it and choose whether to follow the link - so it is NOT a sneaky redirect. As long as a human visitor can see it, I don't imagine it would create a problem if a human at Google did a hand review of the site.

[beu]

It's probably not spam but, what about the links and are they accessible to search engines?

In our specific instance, we're using that JS to show/hide a certain div which contains links to major internal pages.
It would be best if the links were not inside of the javascript. Are they in your specific instance?

[Dr Sledge]

It's probably not spam but, what about the links and are they accessible to search engines?

It would be best if the links were not inside of the javascript. Are they in your specific instance?

Yes, they will be imbedded in the div which will be manipulated by the javascript. I can see where this would be a problem if left alone, but as I read somewhere else, if you use a noscript tag and list the exact same content that is in the JS including links, Google will follow the links and read the content without suspecting anything shady.
Right? Or am I missing something...

[beu]

Yes, they will be imbedded in the div which will be manipulated by the javascript. I can see where this would be a problem if left alone, but as I read somewhere else, if you use a noscript tag and list the exact same content that is in the JS including links, Google will follow the links and read the content without suspecting anything shady.
Right? Or am I missing something...
Nope, sounds like you got it! Good luck :)