CTR for new keywords

[realgames]

Can anyone help with this one. I run an adwords campaign for a niche market in the UK where the number of impressions is never going to be very high. I have recently been trying to learn more and improve my campaign by adding more targeted keyword phrases. For example I sell fine widgets so have have added keyword phrases such as:
"UK fine widgets supplier"
"fine widgets suppliers"

to my existing keyword phrase of "fine widgets" which has one year's history of impressions and clicks and which shows up in position 2.

I have set the same max CPC for my new keyword phrases as for my original one. But I seem to have caused myself a problem because now if someone searches for "UK widgets suppliers" Google will match the search with my new keyword as planned but the ranking has gone down from 2 to 8. With the max CPC being the same I can only assume that Google is assigning a lower CTR to my new keyword phrases than to my original one. So the big questions are:

1. At what level does Google take the CTR for a search? Is it:

- the CTR for the individual keyword matched to the search
- the CTR for the Adgroup
- the CTR for the campaign
- the CTR for the account
- something else

2. What CTR is assigned to a new keyword?

3. How many impressions does it take for a new keyword to be assigned the real CTR for ranking rather than some sort of Google default.

In the example above by keyword "fine widgets suppliers" is showing as having a CTR of over 20% whereas my original keyword "fine widgets" has a CTR of 6% yet a search for "fine widgets suppliers" was placing my ad in position 2 before I added the new keywords and now it is placed 8. How can this be?

[seobook]

Can anyone help with this one. I run an adwords campaign for a niche market in the UK where the number of impressions is never going to be very high. I have recently been trying to learn more and improve my campaign by adding more targeted keyword phrases. For example I sell fine widgets so have have added keyword phrases such as:
"UK fine widgets supplier"
"fine widgets suppliers"

to my existing keyword phrase of "fine widgets" which has one year's history of impressions and clicks and which shows up in position 2.

I have set the same max CPC for my new keyword phrases as for my original one. But I seem to have caused myself a problem because now if someone searches for "UK widgets suppliers" Google will match the search with my new keyword as planned but the ranking has gone down from 2 to 8. With the max CPC being the same I can only assume that Google is assigning a lower CTR to my new keyword phrases than to my original one. So the big questions are:

1. At what level does Google take the CTR for a search? Is it:

- the CTR for the individual keyword matched to the search
- the CTR for the Adgroup
- the CTR for the campaign
- the CTR for the account
- something else
I think at the end they use individual keyword, though they may use the others to help establish credibility and guestimate stuff until there is enough meaningful data...I am not a PPC expert though so I do not know how much the other items play in the feedback. I think I remember reading something about potentially reviewing / readjusting adgroups at each 1,000 impressions.

2. What CTR is assigned to a new keyword? I think the example they use is 1%. They also mention something about normalizing for position...which means they would assume a lower clickthrough rate at a lower ad position.

3. How many impressions does it take for a new keyword to be assigned the real CTR for ranking rather than some sort of Google default.
I have been told 1,000, though I think I have read (not sure) that they also do adjustments when the ad group or gets to some point

In the example above by keyword "fine widgets suppliers" is showing as having a CTR of over 20% whereas my original keyword "fine widgets" has a CTR of 6% yet a search for "fine widgets suppliers" was placing my ad in position 2 before I added the new keywords and now it is placed 8. How can this be?
sounds like the click through rate feedback has not yet kicked in?

[OptimizeOnline]

1. At what level does Google take the CTR for a search? Is it:

- the CTR for the individual keyword matched to the search
- the CTR for the Adgroup
- the CTR for the campaign
- the CTR for the account
- something else



Google considers CTR right down to individual keyword level and is based on the last 1,000 impressions for each keyword.

That said, there is also an overall account CTR that Google uses to consider whether or not specific keywords should be disabled within your account. This account CTR limit is usually around 0.5% but can vary - check out the page entitled Is there a minimum required clickthrough rate? (https://adwords.google.co.uk/support/bin/answer.py?answer=6110) on the Google website.