Conferences - Ripping us off?

[glengara]

Went to my first one yesterday, apart from the likes of G/Y!/MSN people had PAID to give "presentations"!

If this is common practice for the likes of SES/PubCon are the paying customers being taken for a ride?

[evilgreenmonkey]

Appearance fees are uncommon at the likes of SES and PubCon, although are sometimes used to attract speakers (especially Key Note speakers) who will bring in more paying customers.

Micro conferences are a different matter though, these will usually either offer a share in all profits or a fixed attendance fee to the main speakers. This is because the speakers are in most cases expected to give away information that they may not have at a larger conference.

[projectphp]

No evilgreenmonkey, if you read his post he said the PRESENTERS PAID for the right to speak.

I am sure it isn't uncommon, but neither is it the norm on average.

[evilgreenmonkey]

I'm going crazy, sorry about that. Never heard of this before - at a search conference anyhow.

[evilgreenmonkey]

So are speaking engagements by invitation only, or could I buy my way to a SES/PubCon engagement?You can't buy your way onto SES, either in the form of a pay-off or getting a PR agency to big you up. I'm not sure about Pubcon as I haven't had much to do with it (not a big WMW fan personally - mostly because of the forum software).

[glengara]

I'm pretty sure reading about SES looking for possible presenters for past conferences, but not whether any fees were involved either way...

[evilgreenmonkey]

I'm pretty sure reading about SES looking for possible presenters for past conferences, but not whether any fees were involved either way...Pitching for a place on a session panel is open to anyone, new proposals are invited for all of the conferences. The people with the best (or previously successful) presentation will end up speaking. If you're interested in speaking at a future SES conference, the SES Blog (http://blog.searchenginestrategies.com) is where the requests for speakers are posted.

:cool:

Rob

[glengara]

I think I'd prefer presenters to be be paid to speak on a particular topic, expecting presenters to both carry the cost AND not turn it into a sales pitch is an expectation too far, IMO....

[Chris Boggs]

shoot I think I paid Danny $39.63 for my first slot. :)

[Joseph Morin]

DISCLAIMER: Danny paid me 1 British pound for my role as "Official SES Party Coordinator" last year while we were at a pub in London.

If you look at the Speaker proposal and pitch guidlines (http://blog.searchenginestrategies.com/06/12/14-104011.html) you'll see how SES specifically frowns on pitches within the presentations and they typically dont pay speakers.

I'm also one of the conference organizers for PubCon and other than our keynote speakers, we don't pay speakers either although I know we have reimbursed some expenses for exceptional travel and have similar policies regarding pitches during presentations. If we get complaints - then the speakers arent invited back and that is typically revealed during the session evaluations - these are provided during both SES and PubCon so make sure you cast your evaluations to ensure the quality of the conferences.

[ExposureTim]

shoot I think I paid Danny $39.63 for my first slot.

;) LOL

If you look at the Speaker proposal and pitch guidlines you'll see how SES specifically frowns on pitches within the presentations and they typically dont pay speakers.

In my limited experience at past SES conferences, the presenters talk plenty about themselves and the companies they represent. That's not necessarily a bad thing as I, at the time, wanted to hear their pitches.

But I'm not sure that it's really fair to say that just the fact that they officially frown upon pitches actually results in the lack of pitches no matter that the guidelines have actually been typed by someone and posted to a web page (that no one would read if you hadn't linked to it).

[Marcia]

shoot I think I paid Danny $39.63 for my first slot. :)Yeah, well I got paid to NOT speak.

[dazzlindonna]

Let's just pretend that speakers were paid for a moment. How would doing so = ripping us off? I just don't see the connection between paid presentations and ripping off the attendees. I understand that speakers pitching their products without giving "value added content" within their presentations would be a bad thing. (Like how I threw that SEO spam/thin affiliate metaphor in there?)

But just paying speakers doesn't equate to attendees being ripped off in my mind. The speakers, after all, draw attendees to the conference. Without them, the conferences would have far fewer attendees. The attendees pay to attend. The conference owners receive payment. Seems to me that speakers should get a cut of that since they are drawing attendees. Basic business, in my opinion.

In this world of "we want everything to be free and open source", we sometimes forget that money still must change hands in order to keep ourselves fed, clothed, and housed.

I've never been a speaker, so I don't have any ulterior motives here, but I personally think speakers should be compensated for their expenses and time. Just my opinion, though.

[Mel66]

Wait, wasn't glengara saying the speakers paid for the privilege of speaking? That's different than accepting payment to be a speaker.

To me, paying to speak is akin to paying to exhibit - it's like a "booth fee" to tout your wares. I like the SES setup where there aren't as many sales pitches as you find at other conferences. My opinion, anyway.

Melissa

[dazzlindonna]

Ah, if I misunderstood, then I withdraw my comments. :D That's what I get for reading before my second cup of coffee in the morning.

[Joseph Morin]

To clarify: At both SES and PubCon, we don't accept payment FROM speakers either. The speakers are chosen by merit and their knowledge of the subject matter as a an expert in a particular niche.

[projectphp]

And yet many also pay for booths, no?

Who cares really? A conference costs money to put on. If the speakers help with costs, so be it. Quality, not the perception of such, is the key.

[egain]

Not having presented at any of the conferences, if one was asked to speak at one of the bigger conferences and had to pay, I would imagine, the ROI attributable to putting a good presentation together would still be positive, however will highlight thats purely a guestimate, and I guess would be dictated by the quality/type of attendess.

[sportsguy]

Interesting thread. ...it's giving me a headache, though... :(

I speak at SES shows. I do not get paid. (...am I missing out??? LOL)

Speakers do get a spanky ribbon added to their conference pass, though - that's GOT to be worth something...

I'd personally never pay to be allowed to speak somewhere. I mean, if one of the largest topic-focused conferences around, like SES for example, doesn't "charge" speakers to speak, then it's got to say something.

Man, that's just an odd concept in my mind, I guess.

I consider it a privilege to be invited to speak, I take it seriously and follow the rules. Not pitching come easy, though, when you're speaking on In-House matters as an In-House person... ;) Not like I'm LOOKING for YOUR work, too... ;)

[Elisabeth]

Ok, late to the party here, but interesting topic.

It's definitely common in one aspect of the conference planning world to pay for your spot to pitch your product.

So, yes, as an attendee, you go to one of those sessions expecting to truly learn something, and don't - I can see why someone would go to something like that (regardless of who the pitchers are) and feel ripped off. I tend to put these in the categories of EXPOs. Organizers gain from having content generated, presenters gain from peddling their wares/gaining exposures. this happens in many different industries, not just search.

I think it's been fairly well established that SES, Pubcon in particular don't truly operate this way. (aside from some travel expenses, appearance fees, etc)

That's because these two are more educational series than expos.

Glengara, the problem here is that you seem to be lumping in whatever it is you attended with "all" SEM conferences or organizations, but that's defintely not the case, though event formats may vary as this industry continues to grow. However, there are plenty of shows/seminars that are set up this way. So it's buyer beware really.

[JonKelly]

I wouldn't exactly call it an "SEM Conference" but the OMMA Hollywood conference had paid sessions in addition to the normal keynotes & panels. That said, the paid sessions were clearly labeled as such and the one I attended was informational, not salesy at all. No harm there I think.

[mcanerin]

I was just asked to speak/present at a conference about 3 weeks ago - all I had to do was pay a measly $60K and I'd be able to give a presentation and meet with some attendees. Wow!

I declined, of course. To date I've spoke at many conferences and the only payments I've made were my costs to get to the conference itself. Sometimes my travel expenses are reimbursed, or a very token honorarium paid, if I'm exceptionally lucky that day.

I have a fair amount of experience with SES, and it really is frowned upon to pitch your product (unless you are Google, etc, where people are coming to hear about it).

It's just wrong to make someone pay to go to a conference and then expect them watch nothing but commercials and sales pitches. I want at least a free meal, genuine faux emerald and/or Caribbean cruise if I'm going to sit through that!

If the speakers pay, then the attendees should not, and vice versa, IMO.

Sometimes, in-spite of repeated warnings, new SES speakers make sale pitches instead of presentations. This usually gets them really bad comment cards from the audience and they don't get invited back. It's fairly rare, but there is usually at least one jerk per conference that does this. Most speakers (especially the returning ones) don't, however.

From my perspective, it would be hard to expect someone to pay to give a presentation and then not have them look at it as a direct commercial opportunity, rather than a service with possible branding benefits.

On the other hand, if it's free to speak, or if your costs are being covered, I think it would be more likely to be viewed as an opportunity for branding yourself as an expert by giving great information than an opportunity to sell enough services to justify the ROI on the huge payment you just made.

I understand SES sometimes covers travel costs etc if you are an especially valuable speaker, but I've never heard of them asking for payment to speak in the years I've known them. They care too much about their credibility.

And that's a good thing.

Ian

[David Temple]

SES has done a good job of keeping the sales pitches out of the sessions. The only one I've seen was the vendor spotlight at SES Chicago? Did those presenters pay? I enjoyed the session but it was definitely more about the company than the industry. I'm sure there are plenty of vendors wanting to get in on that deal.

[AussieWebmaster]

I'm pretty sure reading about SES looking for possible presenters for past conferences, but not whether any fees were involved either way... Speakers do not pay at SES... I have been speaking there for the last 4 years. You actually get a free pass to the event - full access... and was once given a couple nights accomodation at a new event.

PubCon does not charge their speakers either.... well none of the ones I know.