first post, great forum, need suggestions

[fungusAmongus]

First of all, thanks to all of you for providing such valuable insights into the SEO world. I have spent the past hour reading posts and am amazed by much of the knowledge that is to be gleaned here.

I need suggestions about pricing. I was/am a professional programmer who decided to escape the cubicle farm 4 years ago and open my and my wife's dream, a flower shop. Spiritually, its been fantastic...financially, not so. I work twice as many hours for 1/3 of the money.

But that's beside the point...in building our website I've used my programming skills to learn a little about SEO and have managed to become the organic #1 in Google (http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&rls=en&q=florist+32901&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8) and Yahoo (http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=melbourne+fl+florist&fr=yfp-t-501&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8) for a pretty wide variety of local searches (we are one of the few florists that don't believe in the national game). This ranking has got me noticed my more than a few local companies, so now they are calling me asking about "what can I do for them?".

"so maybe this is something I can do to supplement my income while my shop continues its growing pains", I think. I have several appointments next month with potential customers, and was wondering what the people here recommend on pricing.

My original plan is to offer some sort of tier packages, where I build a 5-page site for $250 with little if no SEO, and then starting charging ??? for upgrades and SEO.

The ??? is my dilemma...what is local SEO worth these days? It seems local search is surprisingly unsaturated these days and that getting near 1 won't be really hard. Since a couple of the companies are construction-related, quick keyword searches show surprisingly little existing SEO.

Can anyone help me with examples of tiered pricing that is working for them? I know this is a touchy subject, but any ideas are appreciated!

[evilgreenmonkey]

I think that the question you should ask yourself is -

Would you rather be a successful florist with large numbers of web orders, or a successful SEO with a pretty shop to work from?

Many chain florists in the UK have an in-house SEO team, simply because the web is fast becoming one of the most popular ways to purchase flowers or find florists. I know that you're just one small shop right now, although if you're able to become the #1 in Google for [Florida florist] for example, you could be in the position to offer franchises to people outside of your shop's geographical reach. The more you can offer, the more people will buy. If you're not ready to grow just yet, how about taking orders on behalf of other florists outside of your catchment and getting a commission from each one?

Every man and his dog offers average/poor design+SEO services these days, and it's not exactly going to make them a millionaire. You're better then that though, you've got your niche market of flowers and can aim to be the best there is in your vertical. Imagine having a sizeable chunk of all online flower orders in Florida and choosing whether to service the order in-house or outsource it for a nice commission! Why spend a week working on someone else's website for $250, when you could earn $250 from each wedding order processed through your portal?

:)

Rob

[fungusAmongus]

I think that the question you should ask yourself is -

Would you rather be a successful florist with large numbers of web orders, or a successful SEO with a pretty shop to work from?

[...stuff deleted...]

:)

Rob

Well, Rob, that is a pretty good question...I guess at this time I am looking at a little of both. The whole idea of trying to compete with the existing floral order gathering SEO teams at ProFlowers and FTD is pretty unrealistic. Like you say they have full time teams of over-caffeinated 20-somethings working 70 hours weeks to meet conversion goals.

Plus, I do not believe in the product...gathering national orders, IMO, is ripping off the customers. This puts me at odds with many in my industry but whatever, if all I was after was the allmighty dollar I would have stayed in corporate IT development.

I see your point about "the world needs another SEO like it needs [insert]". This forum is probably loaded with pros who see people like me every day and chuckle. I can understand that mentality, been there done that.

Over the last day I've drilled a little deeper and found some very good threads on pricing here, so we can skip that question, although I have seen very little on local vs. national optimization.

Then again, I haven't searched as much here on that...

- mark

[evilgreenmonkey]

Hi Mark,
Plus, I do not believe in the product...gathering national orders, IMO, is ripping off the customers. This puts me at odds with many in my industry but whatever, if all I was after was the allmighty dollar I would have stayed in corporate IT development.That's fair enough, my mind doesn't work that way although I see where you are coming from.I see your point about "the world needs another SEO like it needs [insert]". This forum is probably loaded with pros who see people like me every day and chuckle. I can understand that mentality, been there done that.I hope that I didn't come across that way; the newbie of today could be the million dollar affiliate/business of tomorrow. The only people I chuckle at on this forum are the comment spammers who spam an SEO forum (just before I ban them ;)).

What I meant to say is that almost anyone can design a website these days (even my sister, who throws stones at geeks :D), so this has resulted in thousands of part time design agencies starting up every day. I started up a design agency once and moved into a serviced office; the company next to my office was another designer and there were two more on the floor below. An average designer/seo will make below average money and you'll probably end up spending far longer then expected working (you end up working for below minimum wage when you think how long you've spent on a project). You have an additional skill set and interest in flowers. I don't have that, my SEO friends and contacts don't have that - you can probably teach us a few things.

I guess what I'm saying is, combine the 2 things you love and earn more $'s an hour as a florist vertical specialist, not "don't be an SEO". Do you think that you can reproduce your good rankings for another local specific florist search? How much is that worth to someone, compared to a generic design+seo package for any old company?

:cool:

Rob

[fungusAmongus]

Hi Mark,
That's fair enough, my mind doesn't work that way although I see where you are coming from.I hope that I didn't come across that way; the newbie of today could be the million dollar affiliate/business of tomorrow. The only people I chuckle at on this forum are the comment spammers who spam an SEO forum (just before I ban them ;)).
Right. Ok I guess read too much into it...you know when you first post on a new forum it takes a little while to get the jist of the temperament of the core posters. Some boards are ultra-polite, some snarky, etc, etc. ;)

What I meant to say is that almost anyone can design a website these days (even my sister, who throws stones at geeks :D), so this has resulted in thousands of part time design agencies starting up every day. I started up a design agency once and moved into a serviced office; the company next to my office was another designer and there were two more on the floor below. An average designer/seo will make below average money and you'll probably end up spending far longer then expected working (you end up working for below minimum wage when you think how long you've spent on a project). You have an additional skill set and interest in flowers. I don't have that, my SEO friends and contacts don't have that - you can probably teach us a few things.
I'll teach you this...running a business with a product with a 3 day shelf life and unreliable out-of-country suppliers is a PITA at best. It would be a great thing to do *as long as* you don't expect to actually live off it, thus my foray back into self-employed IT grunt work.
I guess what I'm saying is, combine the 2 things you love and earn more $'s an hour as a florist vertical specialist, not "don't be an SEO". Do you think that you can reproduce your good rankings for another local specific florist search? How much is that worth to someone, compared to a generic design+seo package for any old company?

:cool:

That's sound business advice...there is no doubt that 2 years ago I would have *never* considered becoming a web monkey (please, no offense)...and agree that like many businesses with a low point-of-entry it is over saturated with good meaning people who lack the analytical skills to deliver on promises.

I am pretty sure that in local search in my relativley small town, I can dupilcate my flowershop results for other businesses. That would seem to be worth a decent chuck of money these days, as compared to just throwing up web pages. I think the real point of my original post, and I am still debating this, is what its worth.

This thread (http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=9382&highlight=pricing) was very enlightening, and makes what I think is a great point...SEO is worth what someone is willing to pay it for. You can have a great product that in, say, New York is worth $5k, but here in Cocoa Beach Fl no one will spend more than $500 for, so is it worth even getting started on it?

I better figure it out soon, because my first meeting is tomorrow afternoon...