I have an SEO question bout google

[damo222]

Hi. I have a question bout google and I would be grateful for any help.

You know the way u can score more ranking points (so to speak) in google by having your main keyword in the domain name. ex: keyword.com

Well i need to find out if this would also apply the same way if you had your keyword in the subdomain.
ex: keyword.domain.com

also does anyone know if you have frames or links to popup windows with article content in them (different htm page) does the keywords in the other page or the frame page apply for or get counted for the main page?

thanks for any help.
Damian.

[kallestie]

To my knowledge, the reason for the keyword rich domain names is because this is what the search engines look at first for relevance. If it's your domain, then that has to be what you are about.

As far as the subdomains, I have not seen this work with the big guys and I don't believe that it would help your page rank.

...and for the third item, if it is a seperate html page that displays in a pop-up window, then no, it would not get counted on the main page. You could do a layer though. ;)

[dannysullivan]

Please see our standing thread, Commonly Asked: Keywords & Hyphens In Domains & URLs (http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=5496).

[Weblinksonline]

Getting a # position in Google is relatively easy. For example the latest site that i constructed only took 2 months to get #1 position in Google with the search words requested by my customer.

<snip>

They also come #1 in many search engines including Yahoo.

[Weblinksonline]

Getting a # position in Google is relatively easy. For example the latest site that i constructed only took 2 months to get #1 position in Google with the search words requested by my customer.

<snip>

They also come #1 in many search engines including Yahoo.
temporary stair access (http://www.google.co.uk/search?num=50&hl=en&newwindow=1&safe=off&rls=GGLJ%2CGGLJ%3A2006-35%2CGGLJ%3Aen-GB&q=temporary+stair+access&btnG=Search&meta=cr%3DcountryUK%7CcountryGB)

[Chris_D]

Weblinksonline - whilst on the surface - it looks like you've got a great result for temporary stair access it isn't really, is it?

After all - there are only 36 pages on the entire web, as indexed by google, which have 'temporary stair access' in that exact order....

http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&newwindow=1&safe=off&as_qdr=all&q=%22temporary+stair+access%22

And many of them are your forum posts and forum sigs - or links to your site.

Nah - you'll need to do better than that to impress us.

:)

Having a look at all the forums you've posted this on - you need to be aware:

WARNING - When posting for advice on an issue specific to your own website, be aware that if you choose to link to your own website/company name within a post as an example, your site URL/company name may appear within Search Engine Results when a user searches for it. By virtue of your own description of any corresponding SEO related problems your site has, it may create a negative impact on your SEO campaign. We accept NO RESPONSIBILITY should this unintended result occur.
http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/faq.php?faq=code_of_conduct#faq_url_posting

[Weblinksonline]

Weblinksonline - whilst on the surface - it looks like you've got a great result for temporary stair access it isn't really, is it?

After all - there are only 36 pages on the entire web, as indexed by google, which have 'temporary stair access' in that exact order....

http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&newwindow=1&safe=off&as_qdr=all&q=%22temporary+stair+access%22

And many of them are your forum posts and forum sigs - or links to your site.

Nah - you'll need to do better than that to impress us.

:)

Having a look at all the forums you've posted this on - you need to be aware:


http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/faq.php?faq=code_of_conduct#faq_url_posting

Firstly the number of links was not the point. It was the ranking

"Results 1 of about 1,750,000 for temporary stair access"

Thats number 1 out of about 1 & 3/4 million

[Chris_D]

Firstly the number of links was not the point. It was the ranking

"Results 1 of about 1,750,000 for temporary stair access"

Thats number 1 out of about 1 & 3/4 million

No, Weblinksonline - look again - closely - at the search - http://www.google.com/search?q=%22temporary+stair+access%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&newwindow=1&safe=off&as_qdr=all&filter=0

Results 1 - 37 of 37 for "temporary stair access"

Its number one out of 37 pages. There are only 37 pages in Google that have the exact phrase "temporary stair access" on them. 37 pages.

Its not a link search - its a search in quotation marks - i.e. a phrase search.

There are just 37 results - i.e. there are just 37 pages in Google with those 3 words, in that exact order (i.e. phrase) on the page.

Not really a competitive phrase, is it?

[Weblinksonline]

No, Weblinksonline - look again - closely - at the search - http://www.google.com/search?q=%22temporary+stair+access%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&newwindow=1&safe=off&as_qdr=all&filter=0

Results 1 - 37 of 37 for "temporary stair access"

Its number one out of 37 pages. There are only 37 pages in Google that have the exact phrase "temporary stair access" on them. 37 pages.

Its not a link search - its a search in quotation marks - i.e. a phrase search.

There are just 37 results - i.e. there are just 37 pages in Google with those 3 words, in that exact order (i.e. phrase) on the page.

Not really a competitive phrase, is it?


Strange how you apply the quotes for one of my sites, i do not see you apply that criteria to the others who post their results. But still, all that shows is that few people have optimised their site correctly and out of those my site is the Number 1.

[PhilC]

Applying quotes is very useful for finding out how many other pages on the Web are actually concerned with the exact phrase. The number returned indicates how competitive a phrase *may* be, but it will only have some competition if any of the other sites are actually targeting it. In this case, the other sites may not be interested in ranking for the phrase, since, according to Overture, nobody searches on it - last month there were no searches done for that phrase in the Overture engine and its partners.

Anyone can rank very well for that phrase by simply including it in a page. Put it in the Title tag, and you can have the #1 position. There is only one page that is actually targeting the phrase, because there is only one that has it in the Title tag - presumably that's yours.

In a nutshell, nobody else is targeting the phrase, so it is totally uncompetitve.

[Chris_D]

..i do not see you apply that criteria to the others who post their results.

We usually just delete self promotional posts (see http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/faq.php?faq=code_of_conduct#faq_url_posting and http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/faq.php?faq=code_of_conduct#faq_self-promo) - as Marcia did twice earlier in this thread. As you have continued to post the link - despite it being edited / deleted - and as the link was to Google (rather than your own site) - I thought it was generic enough to discuss for the benefit of other members.

And the point of the discussion - as PhilC so eloquently put it - is In a nutshell, nobody else is targeting the phrase, so it is totally uncompetitve.

[Weblinksonline]

The phrase was my customers choice not mine. "The customer is always right". That's what they wanted and thats what they got.

[PhilC]

There's nothing wrong with that as long as you did the research on it and advised him accordingly. It was putting forward how easy it is to rank #1 on Google, and using it as an example, that drew the discussion in this direction:-

Getting a # position in Google is relatively easy. For example the latest site that i constructed only took 2 months to get #1 position in Google with the search words requested by my customer.

[Weblinksonline]

Nice to know that you were not being antagonistic.

This is not leeching, i signed up for this sig. The message is customisable, i have the login to change it. The top two lines are set from multi choice, the bottom is random from a list of 5 of my own making. I do not leech that is dishonest.

[mcanerin]

Weblinksonline,

I've checked danasoft, and although they give people permission to use their graphics (and that it is a neat technology) this forum has rules against signatures.

In view of the fact that it's visually distracting and is accomplished by linking to another site, I'm making a moderator decision to disallow it.

http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/faq.php?faq=vb_user_maintain#faq_sigfiles

Every forum has different rules, and all members are expected to obey the rules of each forum. It's not personal - it's being consistent. Thanks for understanding.

Ian

[Marcia]

Well spoken, mcanerin!

Getting back to the original topic of this thread, an advantage of having the keyword(s) in the domain name and name/title of a site is so that it's present in the anchor text of inbound links to the site.

As a side note, that is why some individuals try to put anchor text laden links to their site(s) in forum posts, a fact which forum moderators are not unaware of.

[Marcia]

The phrase was my customers choice not mine. "The customer is always right". That's what they wanted and thats what they got. That makes this discussion even more interesting, though I fail to see how it relates to the original question asked about when this thread was started in the first place, and raises questions as to why it was even brought up. However, this whole side trip into discussion of how competitive the phrase temporary stair access (http://www.marciahoo.com/archives/2006/11/06/how-competitive-temporary-stair-access-huh-say-what/) is sure does bring up an important IA (information architecture) issue,not to mention the fact that the role that discourse with clients plays during site planning is critical when deciding which phrases to optimize a site for.

[PhilC]

LOL! What a coincidence, Marcia - take a look (http://www.webworkshop.net/blog/?p=10).

I thought of creating a page to take the #1 spot, but I didn't :D

[Weblinksonline]

Weblinksonline,

I've checked danasoft, and although they give people permission to use their graphics (and that it is a neat technology) this forum has rules against signatures.

In view of the fact that it's visually distracting and is accomplished by linking to another site, I'm making a moderator decision to disallow it.

http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/faq.php?faq=vb_user_maintain#faq_sigfiles

Every forum has different rules, and all members are expected to obey the rules of each forum. It's not personal - it's being consistent. Thanks for understanding.

Ian

Thats fine, now i know it was because of that rule not just leeching that it was edited.

That makes this discussion even more interesting, though I fail to see how it relates to the original question asked about when this thread was started in the first place, and raises questions as to why it was even brought up... ......... .

I wonder why it was brought up as well because few people use quotation marks and most search with 3 words. However, good discussions do diversify as they progress.

I spy two posts with links to personal sites, i wonder how long they stay unedited ?

[PhilC]

Those two links are informational to the discussion, and there's a big difference between genuinely informational links and self-promoting links. They both link to articles that explain why phrases like temporary stair access aren't competitive. In fact, it was the temporary stair access example that inspired them. There's a lot of misunderstanding about what is and isn't competitive, and the articles are useful information.

[PhilC]

I've just noticed something. The site is only ranked #1 for temporary stair access in google.co.uk, and only when searching "pages from the UK". When searching "the web" in google.co.uk, and when searching google.com, it isn't even in the top 100, even though none of top 100 (both cases) have the phrase in the Title, so they aren't competing for it. AND there are still only 30+ pages in the entire index that contain the phrase when searching "the web" and google.com! Wow!

It looks like a serious case of keeping a very low profile around the seo world concerning that particular achievement ;)

[Weblinksonline]

I've just noticed something. The site is only ranked #1 for temporary stair access in google.co.uk, and only when searching "pages from the UK". When searching "the web" in google.co.uk, and when searching google.com, it isn't even in the top 100, even though none of top 100 (both cases) have the phrase in the Title, so they aren't competing for it. AND there are still only 30+ pages in the entire index that contain the phrase when searching "the web" and google.com! Wow!

It looks like a serious case of keeping a very low profile around the seo world concerning that particular achievement ;)
At last, quad est demonstrandum (http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/weblogs/blog.html).

[PhilC]

Wow!!! If I were you, I'd remove that link. I just followed a link from it to your main site, and then, after reading about the awards you give for website design????, I went to your portfolio :eek:

[Feydakin]

FTR - I see the phrase at #1 on google.com in at least one datacenter..

[WilliamC]

FTR - I see the phrase at #1 on google.com in at least one datacenter..

So do I, however that will change in the next day or so :p

[Marcia]

Firstly the number of links was not the point. It was the ranking

"Results 1 of about 1,750,000 for temporary stair access (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=temporary+stair+access&btnG=Google+Search)"

Thats number 1 out of about 1 & 3/4 millionWin, place and show.

[Chris_D]

Getting a # position in Google is relatively easy. For example the latest site that i constructed only took 2 months to get #1 position in Google

And to think it only took 2 weeks......

[Feydakin]

A show of hands for all those that are surprised by this??

[PhilC]

Win, place and show.
I'm surprised it took as long as it did.

[WilliamC]

I'm surprised it took as long as it did.

Yep, hope he did not like that result too much. #1-3 are now held by the 2 forums that posted about this.

[mcanerin]

So, technically, he was right - it IS easy to get #1 in Google.

He just forgot to mention that it's only true for non-competitive keywords ;)

Just for fun a few months back, I tried to see how many keywords my own site ranked number one for. Since it's got a bunch of pages on a bunch of topics and is well indexed, I finally gave up looking after about a thousand or so - most of which I didn't even attempt to optimize for and are totally useless.

For example, I so own "mcanerin" <snicker>. I think the number of conversions I've got from that is roughly... zero. :D

It's not the ranking, it's the value of your visitors from that keyword. If no one searches for it (or people search but do not convert) then it's useless.

A major part of SEO is the choice of the correct keywords. Fail this, and it's hard to call yourself an SEO.

As for the OP - the reason you got jumped on here (as near as I can tell) is because you flippently dismissed the abilities and difficulties of a bunch of professional SEO's by dismissing it as "easy", then used an example of your own personal work in an attempt to prove it.

By using a personal example, you invited a personal response by necessity. I think that what this showed is that you need to learn a lot more about SEO before making incredible pronouncments like "Google is easy to optimize for" to a bunch of people who do it for a living and know damn well that it's not true, unless you choose uncompetitive keywords, in which case it's certainly not a good example.

All it did was show that you don't even know what you don't know.

Since many beginners fall into the same trap, I encourage you to check out the SEO resources here and learn as much as you can.

Good luck,

Ian

[PhilC]

For example, I so own "mcanerin" <snicker>. I think the number of conversions I've got from that is roughly... zero.Come on Ian - be a bit more professional than that. You know very well that, if you are going to quote data, then you must quote exact data - "roughly" this or that won't suffice.








;)

[mcanerin]

Oops, my bad. I'll rephrase into proper scientific and statistical language:

Let's see.. well if we apply Chebyshev's inequality theorem (Pr(|X − ¦Ì| ¡Ý k¦Ò) = 1/k2) to my dataset (no conversions) we arrive at the number of conversions being ~0 for the term "mcanerin".

Hows' that? ;)

Ian

[WilliamC]

Phil has created another Kgun :P

[egain]

So, technically, he was right - it IS easy to get #1 in Google.

He just forgot to mention that it's only true for non-competitive keywords ;)

Just for fun a few months back, I tried to see how many keywords my own site ranked number one for. Since it's got a bunch of pages on a bunch of topics and is well indexed, I finally gave up looking after about a thousand or so - most of which I didn't even attempt to optimize for and are totally useless.

For example, I so own "mcanerin" <snicker>. I think the number of conversions I've got from that is roughly... zero. :D

It's not the ranking, it's the value of your visitors from that keyword. If no one searches for it (or people search but do not convert) then it's useless.

A major part of SEO is the choice of the correct keywords. Fail this, and it's hard to call yourself an SEO.

As for the OP - the reason you got jumped on here (as near as I can tell) is because you flippently dismissed the abilities and difficulties of a bunch of professional SEO's by dismissing it as "easy", then used an example of your own personal work in an attempt to prove it.

By using a personal example, you invited a personal response by necessity. I think that what this showed is that you need to learn a lot more about SEO before making incredible pronouncments like "Google is easy to optimize for" to a bunch of people who do it for a living and know damn well that it's not true, unless you choose uncompetitive keywords, in which case it's certainly not a good example.

All it did was show that you don't even know what you don't know.

Since many beginners fall into the same trap, I encourage you to check out the SEO resources here and learn as much as you can.

Good luck,

Ian

Damn it, you mean after all my optimising for pete young, its not worth it :D