While I'm always warey of these sorts of schemes I'm interested in what others think of this? Co-op Advertising Network (http://www.digitalpoint.com/tools/ad-network/)

I have heard (nothing concrete though) they are making pages rise in the Google SERP's, but I'm thinking long term and that Google will not sit back and let unrelated links on such a massive scale artificially boost each others rankings.

My other concern is that, as the ads are shown at random and likely to be unrelated, there is a real chance users could end up linking to a bad neighbourhood. With recent problems of the "non-profit quick smoking" site being busted for this, I think the risk would outweigh any benefit.


Any thoughts?

Only came across it recently, funnily enough, by members trying to promote it ;-)

Not just a terribly obvious link scheme, but a dangerous one too.

It works on the "transient link" system, every time you refresh a page, the links change.
On top of this the pages you link to can come from anywhere, there seems to be a minimum PR requirement, and no drugs/porn/gambling, but apart from that, no quality control system seems in evidence.

With the recent thread on the dangers of linking to "bad neighbourhoods" in mind, I'd advise anyone tempted to join this scheme, to stay well clear.

http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=3279

This thread was originally held so admins could check if it violated our policy (http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=3116) on no spam reporting. It was decided that it did not, given that a network was being discussed, rather than a particular page or a particular search. In addition, the network is now being publicly discussed in depth on another forum: Just How Dangerous are Link Networks? - Coop Ad Network (http://www.threadwatch.org/node/808). Lots of background reading there, for those interested -- and feel free to discuss here as well.

Only came across it recently, funnily enough, by members trying to promote it ;-)

Not just a terribly obvious link scheme, but a dangerous one too.

It works on the "transient link" system, every time you refresh a page, the links change.
On top of this the pages you link to can come from anywhere, there seems to be a minimum PR requirement, and no drugs/porn/gambling, but apart from that, no quality control system seems in evidence.

With the recent thread on the dangers of linking to "bad neighbourhoods" in mind, I'd advise anyone tempted to join this scheme, to stay well clear.

http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/showthread.php?t=3279Actually, it's a little more complicated than that. :)

There is are no PR requirements for sites, but some backend automated evaluations are made on sites via the Google API. Because of this, "bad neighborhood" sites as deemed by Google would end up being allowed into the network, but their ads would have a 0% chance of displaying. This evaluation is done on an ongoing basis, so any change in their status will result in an automatic change on the ad network.

Some other things are evaluated via the Google API, for example how many pages they run ads on (this prevents cheaters from cloaking or creating a million orphaned pages that no one ever sees).

Also, all ads going into the system are put into a Pending status before they are allowed into the rotation (all ads are reviewed by a human). Although a few have slipped through the cracks and were removed after the fact. Additional volunteer ad reviewers are being added to help the ad quality issues.

The first step for assigning categories and language specifics to all ads is also in place already (any new ad going into the system requires the info).

As far as it being a "transient link scheme", if you want to call it that, I think you would also need to deem the contextual ads within Google, Yahoo or MSN search results (which also don't use JavaScript for their ad delivery) the same.

There is also some history you may want to read:

http://www.digitalpoint.com/tools/ad-network/history.html

My main problem with the network is that IMO, it falls within the "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank." parameter.

The other problem for me is the affiliate programme that is an open invitation for members to proselytize for the scheme.

What I meant by a "transient" link was, when I went to check them, many were not even showing on the cached page, never mind the "live" one.

I've read the history, (and I don't believe a word of it ;-) and in fact predict a switch to a paid format (for administrative purposes) within 2005.

My main problem with the network is that IMO, it falls within the "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank." parameter.

The other problem for me is the affiliate programme that is an open invitation for members to proselytize for the scheme.It's not an affiliate program because there is no money to be made. It's a referral system that can only be used by existing members. But if you want to call it an affiliate program, I guess that's your way of looking at it. SEW has an affiliate program too. For example you get referral credit if someone comes in with your userid like so:

http://forums.digitalpoint.com/index.php?referrerid=2456


What I meant by a "transient" link was, when I went to check them, many were not even showing on the cached page, never mind the "live" one.The destination of an ad does not need to run ads themselves. You can use your network weight for a whatever site you want. For example, someone could insert an ad sending people to www.google.com if they really wanted to.


I've read the history, (and I don't believe a word of it ;-) and in fact predict a switch to a paid format (for administrative purposes) within 2005.People have been predicting a paid format for all the free tools I write:

The keyword tracker for example: http://www.digitalpoint.com/tools/keywords/ (up for 1 1/2 years now with nearly 20,000 registered users tracking 424,000 keywords daily). Still free... everything I do (as far as free tools) is for my own personal use and learning first and public use second. We are not a SEO company, and never will be. Nor do we offer any types of subscription services or any services what-so-ever. What we do is develop the best billing and accounting software for various vertical markets (ISPs for example). Anything in the tools section of our site is nothing more than a sandbox for toys in our spare time.

Well I checked a members' links, and going through the the results, I couldn't see his link on the pages returned; either in the cached version or the live one.

*It's not an affiliate program because there is no money to be made.*

But there are benefits for those who sign up new members, so you have a lot of people out there plugging the network.

*You can use your network weight for a whatever site you want. For example, someone could insert an ad sending people to www.google.com if they really wanted to.*

Don't know if I like the sound of that really.....

BTW, you overlooked the "IMO, it falls within the "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank." parameter. ;-)

Just a FYI, I've no ax to grind with DP, I just thought a more measured response was needed to network members proselytizing on the networks' behalf, and will not be posting on this subject again, anywhere, ever ;-)

Well I checked a members' links, and going through the the results, I couldn't see his link on the pages returned; either in the cached version or the live one.

*It's not an affiliate program because there is no money to be made.*

But there are benefits for those who sign up new members, so you have a lot of people out there plugging the network.Okay...

*You can use your network weight for a whatever site you want. For example, someone could insert an ad sending people to www.google.com if they really wanted to.*

Don't know if I like the sound of that really.....Why not? Someone could also use AdWords to send visitors to whatever site they want as well.

BTW, you overlooked the "IMO, it falls within the "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank." parameter. ;-)

Just a FYI, I've no ax to grind with DP, I just thought a more measured response was needed to network members proselytizing on the networks' behalf, and will not be posting on this subject again, anywhere, ever ;-)Fair enough...

digitalpoint, surely the scheme for fall under "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank." No?

digitalpoint, surely the scheme for fall under "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank." No?
Not really... No one will gain any PageRank. It's a co-op, so PageRank is pretty much a wash. There will be some minor variation as far as PageRank gain/loss goes, but it's designed as a "get what you give" ad network. Ranking may be affected I suppose simply because search engines put weight on links, but that's not the "design" or "purpose" of it. So no, I don't feel like it falls into that category.

Once we get some new servers and bandwidth in place to handle the additional loads, I'm going to explore the possibility/feasibility of the links bouncing off a simple redirection script that is not spiderable. Mainly because questions like these become tiresome after the umpteinth time.

I must admit that your site does not push it as a way to increase PR, SERP ranking etc. But at the same time, I feel that is the main reason why people are joining. So, intetional or not, if they coop does increase PR, SERP ranking etc I fear Google will take action. Just like if I drive and accidently crash into another car, my intentions were certainly not to crash, but I did and I will have to pay the price.

Mainly because questions like these become tiresome after the umpteinth time. Didn't see it in your FAQ?

I know... the FAQ is a little dated (I need to also add a clear terms of service and update some of the setup instructions as well). I'm more of a coder than a writer. :) This week I'm working on updating everything for it. For example, today I've started some experimenting with making it self-sustaining (it is supposed to be a co-op after all) without doing away with human reviewers. Now volunteer members can review ads. It puts some accountability into place if a questionable ad gets in.

I've already started thinking about the next level if questionable ads are still getting in. For example make an ad need to be approved by 2 or 3 different reviewers before it's "live".

Today also brought the ability to start classifying ads by category and language as well.

I also finally got around to putting up a specific ad guideline today for people writing ads which already seemed to have cut back on poorly written ads, which makes the reviewing process easier.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again... the ad network is mostly a development and theory playground for me to see if things can be done better and/or more efficiently at some level. The next big challenge is to see if a co-op system can be self-regulating and self-sustaining on a large scale without crappy sites and ads sneaking into the network somehow. For me, it's more about solving problems with code rather than man power.

Hopefully it will become self-sustaining and work a bit like distributed computing, with the users being the "computing".